10-19-2010, 02:12 PM
Hello everyone.
Some history: I am a 30 year old gay male. I have lived in both cities and rural areas. I was in the military and am currently in a Masterâs program.
I wanted to start a discussion here because no one is able to do it in person. The content addresses the many posts in "Need your advice" but I don't want advice. I want to see if maybe I am not alone or that perhaps I am wrong. I want a debate on the matter.
Gay persons have a problem and we need help. Gay people tolerate a lot of injustice in the world. Itâs not fair to be treated a certain way because of something you canât control. Iâm thankful, though, that in many ways the treatment of gays, at least in the West, is getting better. How gay people are treated by straights isnât what I want to address. We need to address how gays are treating other gays. Here Iâll speak about gay men, as I havenât any experience being a lesbian.
Over the last decade Iâve had the fortune and misfortune to meet many people. Iâve come to know exceedingly awesome and respectable persons both gay and straight. Sadly, most of the respectable ones are straight. Iâve always been one to watch people and what they do and Iâve noted a significant character deficit in gay men. Itâs possible that I am just unlucky and that I only come across unrespectable people by chance. I donât think thatâs the case though; I think gay men never learned to be âmen.â That is, by lacking male figures in their livesâ besides other, already tainted gay men âin whom they could confide about relationships, gay men havenât learned about honesty or respect, or fidelity, among other things. I would like to say that this problem exists in a select few, and that itâs uncommon and not worthy of attention. It is not, however, a few gay men that have this problem. Itâs 99.9% of them. I have found that even those who look, act, and most importantly talk the part of a respectable person are the complete opposite. I donât go on about these problems because I have been hurt in relationships, though thatâs certainly what made me take first notice. People I thought were friends behaved in similarly, with dishonesty and other unsavory ways.
I'm a behavioral scientist. I am well aware of âwhyâ these things happen. Gay men lie without remorse because they did so when younger to avoid or remove aversive events. They lied about being gay to avoid ridicule. They pretended to be straight so they would fit it. They left their hometowns for the city so they could âbe who they areâ and became part of a culture that engenders less-than-respectable behavior in young gay men. The new and exciting environment is full of fun theyâd never had, sex on the fly without connection, drug use and superficiality. This, of course, doesnât happen to everyone but itâs more common than not.
What I mentioned isnât new. Itâs not even shocking to most. Weâve accepted it as the way things are. Itâs not healthy, but thereâs a worse problem that stems from the same prior deceptions that is of more concern. If you are part of the gay lifestyle, you come to expect certain ways and if you donât like them you can avoid them. With the other issue, you donât even see it coming.
Iâm talking about the internet and faceless communication. If a man doesnât want to be part of the âgay communityâ then they donât have to be. Guys are easy to find online. The magnitude of what straight people go through because of the internet and pornography is exacerbated by being gay. Itâs easy to move from one person to the next quickly in our new electronic world. We can quickly block people online of whom we tire and find replacements. The problem lies, though, in how this has come to affect life offline.
Gay men want the same things everyone else does: love, stability, and the likeâ or so I hear. They form relationships, both platonic and romantic, and then encounter a problem caused by their history of quick novelty from the history of âbeing gayâ and the internet/wireless communication. Instead of facing a problem in the relationship, likely because theyâve never had the social pressure to man up, they resort to the quick fix of ignore-and-find-elsewhere. Itâs so easy to do. Ignore your friend or partner and head online; itâs as anonymous as youâd like, and if anyone asks about what youâre doing then you can clear the browser or text messages.
I want to say that maturity has a role and that people grow out of these things but thatâs not true. We need a solution and we need a public one. Weâve spent so much time convincing the rest of the world that weâre not horrible, that weâve allowed ourselves and others to in fact become dishonorable, dishonest, and disrespectful without question; if we question whatâs going on weâre called bitter, or close-minded, and told that we should accept people for âwho they are.â
âWho they areâ only goes so far. I agree that being gay isnât changeable, but we can change the rest.
I could go on but wonât.
Please respond: Tell me Iâm wrong or right. Tell me why. Most importantly, tell me how we can fix this so future generations donât have to suffer the trauma that we have.
Some history: I am a 30 year old gay male. I have lived in both cities and rural areas. I was in the military and am currently in a Masterâs program.
I wanted to start a discussion here because no one is able to do it in person. The content addresses the many posts in "Need your advice" but I don't want advice. I want to see if maybe I am not alone or that perhaps I am wrong. I want a debate on the matter.
Gay persons have a problem and we need help. Gay people tolerate a lot of injustice in the world. Itâs not fair to be treated a certain way because of something you canât control. Iâm thankful, though, that in many ways the treatment of gays, at least in the West, is getting better. How gay people are treated by straights isnât what I want to address. We need to address how gays are treating other gays. Here Iâll speak about gay men, as I havenât any experience being a lesbian.
Over the last decade Iâve had the fortune and misfortune to meet many people. Iâve come to know exceedingly awesome and respectable persons both gay and straight. Sadly, most of the respectable ones are straight. Iâve always been one to watch people and what they do and Iâve noted a significant character deficit in gay men. Itâs possible that I am just unlucky and that I only come across unrespectable people by chance. I donât think thatâs the case though; I think gay men never learned to be âmen.â That is, by lacking male figures in their livesâ besides other, already tainted gay men âin whom they could confide about relationships, gay men havenât learned about honesty or respect, or fidelity, among other things. I would like to say that this problem exists in a select few, and that itâs uncommon and not worthy of attention. It is not, however, a few gay men that have this problem. Itâs 99.9% of them. I have found that even those who look, act, and most importantly talk the part of a respectable person are the complete opposite. I donât go on about these problems because I have been hurt in relationships, though thatâs certainly what made me take first notice. People I thought were friends behaved in similarly, with dishonesty and other unsavory ways.
I'm a behavioral scientist. I am well aware of âwhyâ these things happen. Gay men lie without remorse because they did so when younger to avoid or remove aversive events. They lied about being gay to avoid ridicule. They pretended to be straight so they would fit it. They left their hometowns for the city so they could âbe who they areâ and became part of a culture that engenders less-than-respectable behavior in young gay men. The new and exciting environment is full of fun theyâd never had, sex on the fly without connection, drug use and superficiality. This, of course, doesnât happen to everyone but itâs more common than not.
What I mentioned isnât new. Itâs not even shocking to most. Weâve accepted it as the way things are. Itâs not healthy, but thereâs a worse problem that stems from the same prior deceptions that is of more concern. If you are part of the gay lifestyle, you come to expect certain ways and if you donât like them you can avoid them. With the other issue, you donât even see it coming.
Iâm talking about the internet and faceless communication. If a man doesnât want to be part of the âgay communityâ then they donât have to be. Guys are easy to find online. The magnitude of what straight people go through because of the internet and pornography is exacerbated by being gay. Itâs easy to move from one person to the next quickly in our new electronic world. We can quickly block people online of whom we tire and find replacements. The problem lies, though, in how this has come to affect life offline.
Gay men want the same things everyone else does: love, stability, and the likeâ or so I hear. They form relationships, both platonic and romantic, and then encounter a problem caused by their history of quick novelty from the history of âbeing gayâ and the internet/wireless communication. Instead of facing a problem in the relationship, likely because theyâve never had the social pressure to man up, they resort to the quick fix of ignore-and-find-elsewhere. Itâs so easy to do. Ignore your friend or partner and head online; itâs as anonymous as youâd like, and if anyone asks about what youâre doing then you can clear the browser or text messages.
I want to say that maturity has a role and that people grow out of these things but thatâs not true. We need a solution and we need a public one. Weâve spent so much time convincing the rest of the world that weâre not horrible, that weâve allowed ourselves and others to in fact become dishonorable, dishonest, and disrespectful without question; if we question whatâs going on weâre called bitter, or close-minded, and told that we should accept people for âwho they are.â
âWho they areâ only goes so far. I agree that being gay isnât changeable, but we can change the rest.
I could go on but wonât.
Please respond: Tell me Iâm wrong or right. Tell me why. Most importantly, tell me how we can fix this so future generations donât have to suffer the trauma that we have.