Login

meridannight · 03-26-2015, 05:19 AM

just found out about this:

NY Times

CNN

Quote:âThe guy outside is knocking lightly on the door, and there is no answer,â the investigator said. âAnd then he hits the door stronger, and no answer. There is never an answer.â

He said, âYou can hear he is trying to smash the door down.â

too tired to adequately comment, but this is quite weird. someone on CNN speculated that the other pilot might have had a medical emergency, and that's why he didn't respond in any way. that's one hell of a coincidence. the odds are next to nothing that at the same time one of the pilots leaves the cockpit, just that moment the other one has a medical emergency.

03-26-2015, 06:22 AM

It is a strange coincidence, but with no communication coming from the copilot, it is hard to imagine there being any other explanation besides some kind of medical issue with the copilot or some intent on his part to not open the door.

03-26-2015, 08:13 AM

The point of focus is that the plane was in cruise flight. That is the damning aspect. Lufthansa is devastated by this.

The odds of a coincidental failure while the pilot was out to do his restroom business, flirt with the flight attendants, or whatever, is so low. The fact that protocol was violated, leaving only one pilot in the cockpit, is obviously mortifying to them.

Everything is pointing to the very real prospect of a mole in the copilot seat with "nefarious" intent, or a colossal breach of flight protocol by accident. Honestly, I think the Germans would prefer the former to the latter. Madness and depression, or even radical maniacs are preferable to sloppiness for them.

There is also the very plausible scenario that something as banal as sleep apnea could be at work. The remaining pilot in the cockpit, could have lost consciousness, and, if actively flying the plane, my have merely not maintained altitude, gradually driving the plane to its doom as he snored away, but with hands still on the controls. It's a chilling thought coupled with the breach in cockpit protocol. It is by no means unthinkable that a crew member, even a pilot, spent too much time partying or even simply experienced sleep loss without reporting it.

This is shaping up to be an incredible story. Once the fate of the Malaysian flight is learned, this is going to be a signal era in flight history with the catastrophic failures (of either security or technology or both) we are seeing.

03-26-2015, 11:19 AM

The information now suggests that it could have been intentional....but I am thinking the pilot had some kind of emergency ...maybe medical....

I guess we will find out soon enough

03-26-2015, 01:05 PM

News sources reporting deliberate act by the copilot.

Truly shocking if correct. I believe only one other such incident has ever occurred, with an EgyptAir flight.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-3...470970#_=_

03-26-2015, 01:59 PM

One of the things we seem to forget is that the pilots can have burnout and the airline IS their workplace. Every other sort of job experiences crackups with people trying to take revenge at work. When it is a pilot, there simply can be many more bystanders involved.

The attempt to only conceive of terrorism as the culprit is a dangerously limited thinking. Humans do a great deal of inconceivable things without being under the influence of delusional religious manipulation/indoctrination.

03-26-2015, 02:14 PM

Most modern jets have a flight crew of only two (down from 3 or even 4 30-40 years ago). If one of them needs to use the lav or get up for any other reason, there is no choice but for the other to be alone in the cockpit. I guess this is a calculated risk for economics sake (and truthfully there is nothing for the third person to do other than babysit... the tasks of the Flight Engineer and Navigator having been automated) BBC gave four examples, but that is still very low considering the amount of flights everyday. I see some airlines require one of the FA's to go in the flight deck while one of the flight crew is out. Not that they would know what to do to control the plane, but at least they could open the door from the inside if needed.

This sounds awful but on one level I'm glad it is being pointed to a human act if only because we have a cause unlike the MH0370 mystery. The A320 is also the type I fly the most often so it's a small comfort that there isn't some lurking potential problem with all of them.

Borg69 · 03-26-2015, 02:48 PM

I haven't heard a lot of details, but given the facts here, why isn't the "T" word being used?

meridannight · (Edited 03-26-2015, 04:15 PM by meridannight.)

yeah, they've now come to the conclusion that it was a deliberate act on part of the co-pilot:

Quote:“At this moment, in light of investigation, the interpretation we can give at this time is that the co-pilot through voluntary abstention refused to open the door of the cockpit to the commander, and activated the button that commands the loss of altitude,” the prosecutor, Brice Robin, said.

He said it appeared that the intention of the co-pilot, identified as Andreas Lubitz, had been “to destroy the aircraft.” He said that the voice recorder showed that the co-pilot had been breathing until before the moment of impact, suggesting that he was conscious and deliberate in bringing the plane down and killing 144 passengers and five other crew members in the French Alps on Tuesday.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/03/27/world/....html?_r=0

this is definitely strange.

[MENTION=21075]Borg69[/MENTION], why nobody's quoted terrorism....this doesn't quite fit the typical terrorist attack signature. doesn't mean it can't be, but if it is it's certainly an atypical case.

meridannight · (Edited 03-26-2015, 04:41 PM by meridannight.)

Hardheaded1 Wrote:One of the things we seem to forget is that the pilots can have burnout and the airline IS their workplace. Every other sort of job experiences crackups with people trying to take revenge at work. When it is a pilot, there simply can be many more bystanders involved.

from what i heard the co-pilot only had 600-something flight hours. that's a bare minimum to get to fly these airliners in the first place. if he had burnout/psych he would have been screened out in the hiring process (by competent authorities, and by far they mostly are competent). they do psych eval for the pilots at regular intervals. they also screen you for alcohol and drugs, and emotional + psychological stress. you don't get a green light to fly if you are suspected for any of those.