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Great arguments to use against Bible Thumpers!
#41
Paul1 Wrote:So basically saying what I suggested would make... absolutely no difference to how these religious bigots currently think. And no, I'm not going to entertain their diatribe with a serious conversation. Do black people justify their skin colour? Do left handed people justify their handedness? No and no, then why the fuck should I justify my sexuality.

I wouldn't say you have to justify it. It would be better to just ignore them then do something that irritates them, is all I am saying; that only adds fuel to the fire.
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#42
Eromir Wrote:I don't think such arguments can help to improve the acceptance of homosexuals among Christians.

If some Christians believe that being gay is wrong, it's not because of the Bible. It's because of the belief system that has been developing long before and long after the book was written. The Bible is a symbol FOR, not the source OF a set of moral values.

By quoting random passages from the Bible you can prove pretty much anything.
For example - alcoholism is a virtue. Jesus turned water into wine at the wedding, so wine must be preferable to water. Wine is alcoholic... so drinking must be good!
No one would actually yield to such and argument, because it's absurd and in disagreement with generally accepted moral values. Much of what is said in the Bible is ignored for similar reasons.

Such arguing breaks down into a play of words, but that is not philosophy.

The water to wine thing can be read as having been a gross exaggeration of a passed down story plausibly actually a matter of Jesus turning water into wine in the sense that he reasoned people into seeing that water was as valuable a drink if not better than wine. But nobody likes that one.

And it is not about necessarily convincing or altering the view of Christians, but simply having arguments that leaves them to the wind. But also to help those stuck in the restrictive interpretations as well.
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#43
Neither shall a garment mingled of linen and woollen come upon thee
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#44
GeezUS Wrote:I don't believe in 100%...it's a hypothetical mathematical concept.

That is to say outside of controled systems it is unreal. One can say 100% of the voters did such and such but beyond that I find that: It is most likely that nothing can be 100% certain.

Well... of course things, statements, can be 100% certain.

"It will either rain today or it won't."

But, yes... talking about real life events, looking at the probability of any one particular outcome... that will never be 100%. Unless... it's the only possible outcome.

Eromir Wrote:I don't think such arguments can help to improve the acceptance of homosexuals among Christians.

If some Christians believe that being gay is wrong, it's not because of the Bible. It's because of the belief system that has been developing long before and long after the book was written. The Bible is a symbol FOR, not the source OF a set of moral values.

By quoting random passages from the Bible you can prove pretty much anything.
For example - alcoholism is a virtue. Jesus turned water into wine at the wedding, so wine must be preferable to water. Wine is alcoholic... so drinking must be good!
No one would actually yield to such and argument, because it's absurd and in disagreement with generally accepted moral values. Much of what is said in the Bible is ignored for similar reasons.

Such arguing breaks down into a play of words, but that is not philosophy.

Yeah. That's the problem... there's always a passage that can be interpreted (read: twisted) into something they can use to "prove" their point.

And in the rare case there isn't a bible passage ready to go, they chalk it up to "God can do anything" or "if you had faith you would see" or something else ridiculous.
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#45
Nothing divides a people more than religion.

I ask everyone who has participated in this thread to think about what has changed...Has the way you percieve the bible and religion changed? Have you changed anyones elses perception?

In my opinion, even though I have given my 2 cents worth, all relgious based threads should be banned, nothing good will ever come from discussing religion...what are all wars started with?
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#46
dfiant Wrote:Nothing divides a people more than religion.

I ask everyone who has participated in this thread to think about what has changed...Has the way you percieve the bible and religion changed? Have you changed anyones elses perception?

In my opinion, even though I have given my 2 cents worth, all relgious based threads should be banned, nothing good will ever come from discussing religion...what are all wars started with?

I will agree that religion has caused quite more than its fair share of wars and other assorted problems.

I don't agree with banning discussion of it, though. If people get out of line... they can be dealt with individually. But even though religion causes problems, it can still be interesting to discuss. Getting to know what makes other people tick is always nice, and their religion is at the forefront of that topic at least as much as anything else.
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#47
Banning something sends it underground. I'd rather see what I'm up against by staring it in the face. Banning something turns its followers into martyrs. Do we really need any more martyrs?
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#48
Or any more fighters who want 40 virgins?
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#49
Come to think of it? How desperate is that, to give up your life in the hope that in the next life (if it exists) you'll get 40 virgins in reward? What do the virgins say to all that???
Bloody macho wishful thinking.
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#50
princealbertofb Wrote:Come to think of it? How desperate is that, to give up your life in the hope that in the next life (if it exists) you'll get 40 virgins in reward? What do the virgins say to all that???
Bloody macho wishful thinking.

That idea that they are told they will see 40 virgins is not very accurate actually. If they were told such it would be directly contradictory to the kuran. In a very blatant way that most Muslims would find as blasphemy. I find that either there is the small chance that a few are willing to believe that, or it was bullshit made up by the press, or misinterpretations of something said, or one nut balls proclamation. Most terrorists have more advanced reasoning then that, I would suspect.
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