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Inevitability vs. Coincidence
#11
Counselor Wrote:That's odd; I only ever hear Yuko talk about the impact of decisions people make on their own lives. Yes, she's very adept at understanding human reactions, but she doesn't seem to think they are propelled by an unseen force.

There are several seasons and OVA's as well as a movie of xxxholic. I'm pretty sure she has a rather firm believe in fatalism. Although it's been several years since I watched the show so it's possible that I'm wrong of course Smile

EDIT: After looking up some xxxholic stuff to refresh my memory it would seem like she believes CERTAIN things are pre-determined and thus inevitable, but she never says anything about fate controlling everything or "free will does not exist" blah blah. Short version: My mistake, sorry! Leaving the thread now ^_^
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#12
what anime was you watching?
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#13
Since Councelor is offline: He was watching Xxxholic. (Not explicit at all despite the name...) Smile

http://www.anime-planet.com/anime/xxxholic
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#14
I believe sometimes things are pretty much pure coincidence, and sometimes things are pretty much inevitable.

Our actions can lead to later events being nigh inevitable. But It could feel like a coincidence at the time it happens.
Likewise, something happening could feel like it was inevitable, or even fate bound, but it could be coincidental.
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#15
But the choices you make bring about the outcome. It may seem like an effortless arrival, but every step you take is a contribution to that end result, right?
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#16
Counselor Wrote:But the choices you make bring about the outcome. It may seem like an effortless arrival, but every step you take is a contribution to that end result, right?

If our choices and free will are a factor then nothing that happens (at least not in cases like your mom's calls) are an inevitability.

Maybe you could explain how you think the process worked with your mom? That is, WHY? Because it sounds as though you're saying it would be impossible to prevent someone being uncomfortable for too long, that it was "inevitable" that the problem would at least be brought to her attention.

And how many times do you think it happened that she DIDN'T find out? That is, what makes you think this mistake was the only one time it happened and thus "corrected" when it could've happened many times over (and not be found out), even to the same person?
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#17
The problem with talking about the specifics of death is that no one wants to talk about that because it's scary instead of comforting. It's so bad that even when some mystical principle is promoted people will overlook those not protected. For example, when a bunch of miners were thought alive the USA was praising God for the miracle but when it turned out they were actually dead then suddenly no one was mentioning God anymore or asking where God was.

Another example is the recent Sandy Point shooting, one little girl was smart and played possum and there were people thanking God for her being alive (actually, no, it was her quick thinking that saved her, not God) and not even realizing how obnoxious & offensive they were being saying God saved her and not all her friends and classmates, it implies the dead DESERVED to die, but of course the people making that assertion don't think about the dead, they just think about the living in coming up with the notion that "God is real and protecting me" because thinking on all those God didn't protect is just too horrifying for them.

But I'll be back in a moment to share about another spooky example.
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#18
A woman shared a horrifying story of coincidences with me. As a Russian Orthodox she had a new apartment blessed by a priest when she moved in that was to protect her from evil (includes that famous Psalms about the "valley of death," too) and left an icon of St. Michael to protect her. Almost right after a man selling magazines stopped by and asked for a glass of water. As it was a hot day and thinking of the woman who gave Jesus a drink at the well she did. That night someone took out her window AC and climbed in while she prayed her prayers, paralyzed with terror, and though she thought she might want to stop him before he got in or run she felt it was showing a "lack of faith" and "good girls don't fight." It was the guy she gave a glass of water to and he raped her so savagely (and knocked teeth out) that she required multiple surgeries. Most of it happened under the watchful gaze of her icon St. Michael that she kept pleading to. Ironically, when she changed her prayers to the grace to die well he left her alone, though to mock her he put a phone by her.

He was caught just a few blocks away trying to hide but because it was dark among other technicalities he was pretty much off. As the cops said he was a serial rapist (and she met victims before and after her as well) who knew how to game the system and pretending to be a magazine salesman was one of his tricks to find future victims. And his real name was...Michael. And he got off the charges against her as he had with other women before & after as if mystically protected.

She lost her friends when she needed them the most because she was proof that God didn't protect those supposedly protected by prayer, and that the rapist who overcame God's supposed protection being named after the angel called upon and icon left in her room where it happened only added spooky insult to injury...as if maybe the serial rapist had somehow been evoked by the priest, and that was too disturbing to think about. And she shared this with someone collecting stories about angelic coincidences, but of course it wasn't published with all the feel good stories (ever wonder how many stories like hers exist, perhaps even victim of the same serial rapist?).

Years later after she renounced Christianity and embraced Wicca she burned that St. Michael icon in a magic rite designed to rid her of the demons by her past trauma, and at first it refused to burn, and then suddenly, after chanting spells over it, it burned rapidly to dust, and she felt much better.

As for being raped by a guy who seems mystically protected after she was supposedly mystically protected by an angel of the same name with the angel's blessing said shortly before it happened: coincidence or inevitability?
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#19
My mother's situation wasn't brought about by the client, it was the caretaker calling back to find the reason for the pocket-dial call, thinking that maybe it was a dire issue. As it turned out, my mother didn't have an urgent message, but discovered that the caretaker had not followed her instructions. She chose to call back and apologize for the pocket-dial, and without that choice, she would have gone without knowing the client's condition until her next visit. The caretaker chose to pursue the reason for the pocket-dial, and without that call, my mother would have let the pocket-dial slide. All of those choices led to an outcome that could not be prevented. That's what I mean by inevitable.
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#20
^^

It doesn't sound inevitable at all, just lucky.
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