Feminism and hatred towards feminism

[pellaz]

... I just want complete gender equality.

not possible to have equality but gender respect is.

[sillyboy86]

Actually I'm not sure, but in the last months I thought I'm a bit feminist. You can imagine what I think.
In Italy we have a male-dominated society (but we're arrears in general, thanks to the Vatican etc...), even the women are not aware of what they should be their rights, they often agree to be almost considered inferior.
Maybe I'm only antisexist, but in the Italian society I consider myself a feminist.

Oh and I listen the music of The Knife, a quite feminist Swedish duo.

[Brendan]

Ive worked with feminists and have a good friend who is a die hard feminist, but she isnt one of these bra burning, man demeaning women. She is married with kids, but she only has problems when she sees women being taken advantage of. This story would make her scream and shout and write some pretty nasty letters.

It is my opinion that "sexually liberated" countries are only that way, so men CAN get away with beating their wives and kids, cheating on their wives, and raping any female they want. And to me, these pieces of human garbage need to be hung from very tall trees, in public places, so everybody can see that it is not a "mans world" after all. Those who make the laws should be hanged by them.

Would this judge pass the same verdict if it was HIS daughter that was raped????

Sometimes I am SOOOOO embarrassed to be a man!

I've never been embarrassed to be a man. Both sexes are equally admirable and equally awful.

I have no problem with feminists. Females were kept under the thumbs of males in a physical and political sense for so many thousands of years I can't blame them for being aggressive about fairness and equality. Some of them do take it ridiculously far though, such as those who proclaim all men racists.

[Pix]

Bad feminism 1 is definitely infuriating. The problem is that the lines between good and bad feminism are getting blurrier to people. I've seen lots of otherwise openminded and intelligent people who completely generalize feminism as a whole in... well, not very charming ways.

I wanted to add that when people confuse fringe man-hating feminists with mainstream feminism it actually helps the man-hating feminists they despise by pushing the mainstream closer to the fringe and validating that there's a "war on women" going on. If I hadn't known some really good men in my life I think I'd have become one by now. The thing is the misogynists need the man-haters and vice versa or they both suffer.

[OrphanPip]

I have no problem declaring myself a feminist. There is a general disconnect in the public imagination between what feminism actually is and what people think feminism is. I work on prostitution narratives and so I spend a great deal of my time thinking about the ways women are thought about, the ways they are represented, and the way women are treated. I'm highly skeptical of the criticism of supposed misandry that some associate with feminism, I subscribe to the belief that it is largely a strategy of dismissing the concerns of women, making it all about the victimized male, who apparently suffers so from the influence of women that they in general continue to control the vast majority of the wealth and power in every nation.

Of course, I don't agree with the views of every feminist thinker, but I find most often the criticism being leveled at feminists are terribly misinformed. Can anyone name a "bad feminist" thinker? Can you outline what their arguments and beliefs are in a detailed way? There are feminist thinkers I fundamentally disagree with, like Lacanians such as Luce Irigaray or Sex-Negative feminists like the late Andrea Dworkin and her husband John Stoltenberg. Although, I doubt most people who dismiss these kinds of thinkers have read their work or really care to understand the position of the feminists they react to in a basically dismissive, knee-jerk fashion.

[dvdbwn]

men and women are never going to be the same but that's not what's meant by gender equality. it's about women having the same rights as men, and vice versa. in this case, the right to not be attacked at a party, the right to say "no", the right not to be blamed for being victimized, or the right not to be taken advantage of when intoxicated. (in some places engaging in sex with an intoxicated woman is tantamount to rape). and it works both ways. my friend, a guy, was raped at a party where he passed out and woke up to a girl riding him and she was convicted of rape.

i know almost nothing of the UK but in the US men and women are far from being equal... never had a woman president nor do women make the same money for the same job. nor are women throughout the world treated equally... there are some horrific stories out there.

part of the problem with all minorities is the cliche, when you're a hammer all you see are nails. meaning when you're so attuned to pointing out sexism (or racism, heterosexism, or whatever ism) it becomes all you see.

recently, the host of the academy awards came under fire for composing a song called "we saw your boobs". a read an article by a feminist who thought it was rife with sexism and all sorts of inappropriateness. 1. it was a joke, 2. it was about actresses who voluntarily disrobed on camera, 3. many of the actresses partook in the gag for the award show. i'm not saying the author of the article didn't have any valid points but it would behoove feminists and whoever to pick their battles. (the one caveat of this is that one of the actresses mention didn't voluntarily disrobe on camera but had her privacy violated when her cell phone was stolen on which she had topless photos of herself- which is a totally different conversation)

[Viscova]

Men need to stop when a woman says no. But at the same time, when women pass out drunk, then wake up and accuse men of rape. It is too much. We all feel depleted and dead when we wake up after a night of alcohol. Not to say that sometimes, women aren't raped. Sometimes they are, and that is disgusting. But that doesn't mean that alcohol is always going to be the agent of rape, and not her. Men and women are equals. And that needs to be understood.

[partisan]

Orphanpip heres one - Valarie solonas wrote the feminist manifesto - scum (society for cutting up men )

Then shot andy warhol, who later forgave her - she wasnt sorry.

[partisan]

Oh scum is a feminist "classic" apparently.

[OrphanPip]

Oh scum is a feminist "classic" apparently.

It should be, because it is of its moment and important because of its political legacy. Besides the fact that the acronym for SCUM was created by her male publisher, Solanas' text is part parody and partly serious. The anger and the call to radical action are sincere, but the hyperbole of the calls for violence and complete overthrow of society are part of the ethos of the 60s counter-cultural moment. She wasn't serious about eliminating men from the world, which should be evident from the fact that she collaborated with men in the publishing of the work. Solanas instigated a kind of feminist activism that was necessary at the time, an in your face attitude that didn't shy away from speaking out about the issues and refused to frame the discussion in the terms dictated by the male dominated establishment. This kind of activism always has its downsides in the extremes that it brings to the fore, but it is also important. It is reflected in gay rights movements with groups like Queer Nation and Lesbian Avengers, or in the African American civil rights movement in figures like Malcom X.