Damian hirst is not an artist!

[VileKyle]

I'll break it down for you partis. Basically, what you're saying is that Damian Hirst is not an artist because you don't see the value in his work. This is why I have a problem with that: you are saying anything you don't like is not art. A lot of people don't like my art either, and yet my lifestyle is still the life of an artist now. Maybe it's not going to impress many people, but I still consider it art.

Success is not the way anyone should be valuing art, so I do agree that Damian's success should not be the measure of his art's value. It is still art though, and obviously there are people who do value it. You just aren't one of them (and if I'm honest, I'm not either). It does have its own artistic value somewhere though, so there's no reason to throw scorn at it for existing.

I'm also not trying to say that Damian is the next Van Gogh. I'm saying that they can be compared in one way (not all ways), since Damian's work is being called crap here, just like Van Gogh's was. Art should never be criticized in that manner. There's always more depth to something than what you may be allowing yourself to see.

[partis]

If you read some of my comments you,ll see that i havent disclaimed anything as not being art just because i dont like it, im sure your art is fine, like festinos… i havent seen it… goodnight

[VileKyle]

If you read some of my comments you,ll see that i havent disclaimed anything as not being art just because i dont like it

Oh?

well said mistertinkles and these so called artist work will end up in a trash heap not a museum.

I guess you didn't post that then. How about the topic title? And I'm also looking at your posts, Tinkles. I'm not just talking to partis here. Art is entirely subjective. If you don't like it, that's your own view of it and that's fine. It doesn't mean it's crap, or that it isn't art, though.

[Bowyn Aerrow]

I don't know...

Any guy who can strip down naked and rub horse apples, Cow Patties and the white stuff which is on chicken shit all over their body is an artist in my mind...

This dude you are talking about that did? No? Maybe he should, earn that title of Artist....

[LONDONER]

There have been other examples of artists being mocked in their lifetimes, not the least Turner, now considered Britain's greatest artist and the founding father of impressionism. There is a vast difference between Turner and Hirst. I could not emulate Turner in a year of Sundays but I could make a Hirst "painting" as many others have done and do. He employed a team of "painters" to paint his "dot" paintings. Yes, I know that many great artists in the past have employed helpers, from Titian, Rubens etc., but they only painted minor parts of the backgrounds. When Hirst employs a team to paint a series of different coloured dots and then signs it, that is fraud.

I studied art and as part of my studies we did academic drawings, life drawings (A marvellous teached called Mr Millard who could and demonstrated that he could draw like Michelangelo) etc. They seemed dull classes at the time but I realised that they were a solid foundation for my later, more creative works. I was never a great artist but at least one of my paintings was highly praised Julian Trevelyan (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julian_Trevelyan). I was most certainly a better painter than Hirst but never made money like he did!

[Bowyn Aerrow]

Yes but did you cover your naked body in various species fecal matter? If no then how can you call yourself an Artist???

Ok, all jokes aside, what makes an artist an artist? Seriously is it their ability to do a thing, or is their ability to think a thing and by any measure make it real?

Dots - sure, having a lot of people do different dots may not seem like a creative endeavor, but seriously have you ever tried getting a bunch of humans do cooperate and do a thing?

Consider Stephen Hawking, He is considered a brilliant physicist, does he actually sit at the computer to input the data that leads to whatever the computer computes? Does that make him less the genius? It is his thoughts, not his actions that make him the leading genius of our particular dark age.


I think this whole getting other people to do each different dot is part of the art. Art is never about the finished piece, but the process by which the piece is derived also counts. Art is a thought process, a thought concept which manifests itself into the world.

When a can of soup can be considered art, then we can not use our own biases and narrow understandings to define what is and is not art. One man's trash is another man's treasure. Art by it nature defies real explanation... Seriously, if can do it its all over for the critics.

The expressions and forms of 'art' are many, photography is now an 'art', computer enhanced images are an 'art'... So we cannot say that because the artists hands hasn't touched the project directly its being 'art' is void.

So what if each dot is done by other people and the artists hands never touch the project? Does this actually invalidate that it is art, or does that very act make this art a new art form, one which we should cherish for its uniqueness of production?

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art1
ärt/
noun
noun: art; plural noun: arts; plural noun: the arts
1. the expression or application of human creative skill and imagination, typically in a visual form such as painting or sculpture, producing works to be appreciated primarily for their beauty or emotional power.

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The expression of human imagination.... Hmm. does that mean if I have a team of people draw dots on some medium that my imagination suddenly lapsed, or does it mean my imagination just leaped from impulse drive to warp speed? hmmmm

The mere fact that we are able to talk about this 'art' and have opinions and emotional experiences related to these/this piece(s) tells me that we are having an art moment (and in my case a rare art conversation since I don't follow such gay things in general :biggrin.

Therefore I submit that this fits the definition just because this 'thing' has emotional impact, albeit it negative for most but still an emotional impact, a reaction to this thing which must be 'art' because it certainly isn't science.....

Again, and I can't stress this enough, I have absolutely no interest in the art world. But if I, a man lacking interest in the art world, viewing art as an exercise in futility can see this as an art form, then those of you who are creative and crap (faggots!) need to seriously rethink what 'art' is and listen to the Neanderthal, knuckle dragging dude who can clearly see that by definition that this is 'art' and by your reactions this is pretty good art since it got all you queer gay types to talk about it....:biggrin:

Don't underestimate the more primate, less evolved members of your social grouping.

This is art - bad art it may be, but art nonetheless cause it got all of you to talking about it.

Although various species of fecal matter on nude male bodies is far more interesting.....

[partis]

Ok its art…

The same way a cat screeching can be considered music. I think you bowyn put more thought into his work than he himself does, since he just draws dots , hell he doesnt even draw dots himself. it has no BEAUTY or EMOTIONAL power that one can speak off… a child with the right tools and teaching could reproduce it.

Ok its art

But its fish & chips not caviar. I like fish & chips but dont tell me its caviar or that in 50 years time it,ll be caviar cause it,ll still be fish & chips.

not a good example cause i really do like fish and chips.

[EvenOlderButWiser]

But is Banksy?

ll he does is spray paint stencils....

ObW
X

[LONDONER]

But is Banksy?

All he does is spray paint stencils....

ObW
X

No, sorry, you're wrong there. He is best known for his stencilled work (that are creative), but he is an artist who has had his painted works shown at the Tate in Cornwall. Sorry, I can't find a link. His stencilled work are often social criticism that move the emotions as good art should. Yes, his work is art.

This is an interesting posting from the Internet:

http://www.leandroiriarte.com/banksy.php

And this is another that curiously, shows a collaboration he did with Hirst. Personally I think that it was a dig a Hirst that probably Hirst didn't understand.

http://www.gwarlingo.com/2012/banksy-arc...rt-genius/

[LONDONER]

Attached is a sample of Banksy's social criticism, to draw attention to the use of child labour in British sweat shops. And another, probably one of my favourites.