Imitations of Life

[princealbertofb]

So listening to a programme on BBC Radio Four today about sexual harassment, I was not really surprised to hear that (teenage / young adult) boys get the wrong idea about how to treat partners because they get their examples from porn. But as unlikely as the scenarios offered by porn are, is there a possibility that porn might actually offer us gays a more realistic idea of what gay sex can be like ?
I realise that porn is generally all scripted and that this industry is actually not as fun as it may sometimes look, but because we are a niche group, is it possible that gay porn illustrates our sex lives better than straight porn does? What examples do you think are relevant to our actual sex lives?

[princealbertofb]

By the way, here's the programme I was referring to. You might be interested to listen to it.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b07tqpxj

[princealbertofb]

Bumping this one up again... I need your views, guys.

[LJay]

I find it quite a leap from that BBC program to gay porn. I am not impreseed that gay porn is any more realistic than any other porn. Do you think there is a realistic range of penis sizes? Do you think that anal sex is any more real in porn? Are the muscled and handsome actors the same as the guys we all know? I think the reality is much from the films in many, if not most, cases. Niche porn is made by filmmakers and actors in response to niche fantasies. The films I have seen are not very realistic at all.

By the way, I remember when Imitation of Life came out and no one thought that Lana Turner was "real" in the sense that she might show up in one's neighborhood. She represented a glamorous ideal. I was also too young to watch such a movie and that was made clear to me by my parents.

[LONDONER]

All porn whether hetro or homo, is fantasy and has very little to do with real life.

[princealbertofb]

I find it quite a leap from that BBC program to gay porn. I am not impreseed that gay porn is any more realistic than any other porn. Do you think there is a realistic range of penis sizes? Do you think that anal sex is any more real in porn? Are the muscled and handsome actors the same as the guys we all know? I think the reality is much from the films in many, if not most, cases. Niche porn is made by filmmakers and actors in response to niche fantasies. The films I have seen are not very realistic at all.

By the way, I remember when Imitation of Life came out and no one thought that Lana Turner was "real" in the sense that she might show up in one's neighborhood. She represented a glamorous ideal. I was also too young to watch such a movie and that was made clear to me by my parents.

Haha, [MENTION=20933]LJay[/MENTION], I think it might be time for you to re-watch the movie. I don't think Douglas Sirk ever meant for his films to be realistic, but the situations he talked about could be quite humanly inspired. He did tend to over represent and exacerbate the emotional situations. However, the fact that some of us aren't, on average, as beautiful as the beautiful people, does not mean that these situations don't happen to the beautiful people in question.
I also realise that some studios seem to have a 'formula', one that generally works for them, but some porn does seem more realistic (in terms of sex acts) than other stuff. I'm not talking about whether the condom appears as if from nowhere (which it regularly does - or doesn't, it depends on whether they make it part of the 'ritual' or not). I also realise that models/actors are generally chosen for their ability to embody some kind of sexual or bodily ideal. Does it mean that the sex represented is not the kind of sex that you might have in terms of sex acts, regardless of the partner's plastic qualities?

[princealbertofb]

All porn whether hetro or homo, is fantasy and has very little to do with real life.

I don't know if I would be as definitive about that, @LONDONER. Of course it's fantasy, of course there are ellipses in what is shown, and of course it's generally closely edited (a good thing it is, because otherwise we'd be quite bored by the constant interruptions in the 'action', if only to change the camera angles).

What I find the most contrived in porn, and gay porn is no exception, is the scenarios attempting to make people intimate when in fact there is no build up to the intimacy (except maybe if the story is about two (or more) guys who are together to have sex and that's settled from the beginning. ''Here's X and Y, they are going to have sex for us to watch and enjoy, so off you go, X and Y, enjoy yourselves and give us a good wank.'' I don't mind those stories, they're hookups and that's what they are purported to be, nothing more, nothing less. Will the models have chemistry, will they have 'real' fun having the sex? That can depend.

Because porn doesn't comment what is happening and how people are feeling as they are doing it, it can't be used as guide to how sex can happen, and yet, some scenes seem to give a fairly accurate idea of what it could feel and be like. Do you see that guy wincing as he is penetrated (is it put on or is the discomfort real and overcome to some extent?)? In the end we all know that the penetration will have to happen, so that's why there is so much preparation, and why the models do whatever they do. That's the part that gets into the way of the fantasy, and that's why they don't show it, or show it in the outtakes or behind the scenes.

I also realise that everything has been done (generally) to remove the unpleasant sight of body wastes other than saliva and sperm, and sweat). So the messes are avoided and that's not realistic at all. But then in porn, as it is mainly visual, you also lose a lot in the sense of smell and touch (tactile sensation) which our minds can only be reconstructing from our personal experiences.

I guess what I was asking about was, is it easier to watch gay porn and get an idea of what might happen between two men (or more) and not have unrealistic expectations or is all porn such fantasy that there is no reality to any of it? There has got to be some degree of realism, isn't there?

[princealbertofb]

[MENTION=20933]LJay[/MENTION], you talked about quite a leap, from the programme to gay porn. Well, as you are probably aware, there is very little said and done about sex education and about relationship education in some countries, and even countries that address these are likely to mention gay sex far less (if only because it's, in its way, a little 'niche'). So here's the issue : if young men get their ideas of what is acceptable to do and try with young women (teenagers will be curious) from porn and if that porn shows fantasy but also unrealistic social interactions (like the total availability of women to have sex at the drop of a hat), what sort of message does gay porn send to young men and women watching it? Does it give our youth representations of sex encounters that are as unrealistic or are these encounters more realistic because men having sex with men are more direct and because that area of sexual experimentation is more consenting? So I guess my question was more about the consensual nature of the sex. In a way, you know that if you're watching two guys having it off, it's because they've both consented to it, rather than they have been coerced. I may be talking out of my arse.... who knows?

[princealbertofb]

I'm not trying to imply that gay rape does not exist, as we know this is probably much under-reported. And I'm not trying to say that non consensual sex is never represented in gay porn either. I'm sure there are young models out there who are doing it for the wrong reasons, be it a way of making quick money, or supporting a drug habit etc... And we've also all seen gay-for-pay models who don't seem to be enjoying much of what they are doing (what a drag it must be!), but that's not the porn that 'works', is it? Unless you are into uncomfortable /awkward / lame situations.

[princealbertofb]

As an aside, I think my first visual experience of a sexual situation between two men was a mouth rape scene in The Scarecrow (Al Pacino and Gene Hackman in the main roles) and boy, was that disturbing. I could have gone through life thinking that all gay sex was that horrid and sleazy and violent. But then, this was not porn, just a prison situation which could have been violent in so many other ways. What transpired in the end of the film was this wonderful relationship / friendshio between the two main protagonists. Phew! But what hell they had to go through.