So, I think I read about this research with mice a few months/years back...
Good news for gay couples that want biologically related off-spring.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/16/healt....html?_r=0
Quote:Within a decade or two, researchers say, scientists will likely be able to create a baby from human skin cells that have been coaxed to grow into eggs and sperm and used to create embryos to implant in a womb.
The process, in vitro gametogenesis, or I.V.G., so far has been used only in mice. But stem cell biologists say it is only a matter of time before it could be used in human reproduction — opening up mind-boggling possibilities.
With I.V.G., two men could have a baby that was biologically related to both of them, by using skin cells from one to make an egg that would be fertilized by sperm from the other. Women with fertility problems could have eggs made from their skin cells, rather than go through the lengthy and expensive process of stimulating their ovaries to retrieve their eggs.
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Great news. Wish I can have a biologically related baby one day.
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I see women becoming obsolete.
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meridannight Wrote:I see women becoming obsolete.
Oh my. Imagine if we became a monosex species! Our dating pool would double. Sexism would be extinct. Gender fluidity would be as understandable as shoesizes.
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meridannight Wrote:I see women becoming obsolete.
It could easily go the opposite way.
Quote:I.V.G. requires layers of complicated bioengineering. Scientists must first take adult skin cells — other cells would work as well or better, but skin cells are the easiest to get — and reprogram them to become embryonic stem cells capable of growing into different kinds of cells.
Then, the same kind of signaling factors that occur in nature are used to guide those stem cells to become eggs or sperm. (Cells taken from women could be made to produce sperm, the researchers say, but the sperm, lacking a Y chromosome, would produce only female babies.)
Especially since it still would require being implanted in a womb.
But I'm not going to take any of this seriously until I see it reported by a more reliable source than the failing New York Times. Fake news. Sad.
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05-19-2017, 10:24 PM
(Edited 05-19-2017, 10:30 PM by meridannight.)
Emiliano Wrote:It could easily go the opposite way.
No, it can't. The fascinating thing is the physiology behind this -- females don't have the genes to make sperm. Females are XX karyotype, and men XY, as we all know.
Men have the X chromosome and the Y chromosome. The genes needed to make sperm (and testicles, for that matter) are located on the Y chromosome. Females simply don't have the genes for making sperm cells. They can make all the eggs they want, but without sperm, babies still won't happen. The reason why they can engineer egg cells from male skin cells is precisely because men possess the X chromosome like women do.
If this skin cell conception ever becomes a reality, then it means men will be capable of producing male and female babies. Females will not have the same capacity. Females are only needed for carrying the term (unless we engineer to bypass that as well).
Women will become obsolete, as a result. Technically speaking. And yeah, I do like the prospect of that.
''Do I look civilized to you?''
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meridannight Wrote:No, it can't. The fascinating thing is the physiology behind this -- females don't have the genes to make sperm. Females are XX karyotype, and men XY, as we all know.
Men have the X chromosome and the Y chromosome. The genes needed to make sperm (and testicles, for that matter) are located on the Y chromosome. Females simply don't have the genes for making sperm cells. They can make all the eggs they want, but without sperm, babies still won't happen. The reason why they can engineer egg cells from male skin cells is precisely because men possess the X chromosome like women do.
If this skin cell conception ever becomes a reality, then it means men will be capable of producing male and female babies. Females will not have the same capacity. Females are only needed for carrying the term (unless we engineer to bypass that as well).
Women will become obsolete, as a result. Technically speaking. And yeah, I do like the prospect of that.
According to that article, specifically the part I quoted, using this technology, cells taken from women can be coaxed to create sperm as well, but would only be able to produce female children. But if sex as reproduction becomes obsolete, and the goal is to eradicate the need for different genders, that wouldn't be an issue.
And I don't doubt that you do. Though I would argue that the worth of a human (or a group of people) and their ability to contribute to the world and society are not strictly limited by their ability (or need) to reproduce.
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05-20-2017, 12:17 AM
(Edited 05-20-2017, 12:25 AM by meridannight.)
Emiliano Wrote:According to that article, specifically the part I quoted, using this technology, cells taken from women can be coaxed to create sperm as well, but would only be able to produce female children. But if sex as reproduction becomes obsolete, and the goal is to eradicate the need for different genders, that wouldn't be an issue.
And I don't doubt that you do. Though I would argue that the worth of a human (or a group of people) and their ability to contribute to the world and society are not strictly limited by their ability (or need) to reproduce.
From what I understand how that process could work still needs a man. I'm gonna quote from wikipedia, since it's most accessible:
Quote:Creating female sperm was first raised as a possibility in a patent filed in 1991[3] by injecting a woman's cells into a man's testicles, though the patent focused mostly on injecting altered male cells into a man's testes (to correct genetic diseases).
In 1997, Japanese scientists partially confirmed such techniques by creating chicken female sperm in a similar manner.
And even more clearly:
Quote:Biologists have well established that male sperm production relies on certain genes on the Y chromosome, which, when missing or defective, lead to such men producing little to no sperm in their testicles. An analogy, then, is that a cell from a woman has complete Y chromosome deficiency. While many genes on the Y chromosome have backups (homologues) on other chromosomes, a few genes such as RBMY on the Y chromosome do not have such backups, and their effects are needed to be compensated for to convert cells from a woman into sperm.
Yes. You can make sperm created from female cells, but in order to do that you need male testicles. So, my argument stands. Men can make either male or female babies. Women can't make anything without men, as it turns out. Our ancient ancestors weren't that far off, women are just carriers for fetuses, that's all.
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I personally find these kind of advancements disturbing, more often than not. Too much of the scientific community is so focused on the "can we", and completely omit considering the "should we" part of the equation.
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TwisttheLeaf Wrote:I personally find these kind of advancements disturbing, more often than not. Too much of the scientific community is so focused on the "can we", and completely omit considering the "should we" part of the equation.
I have to agree with you on that one. I've felt that way with some of the scientific developments as well. Nuclear weapons is a case in point. Human genetic engineering another. That's just a couple of examples.
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