Hippies & Gays

[Pix]

I was curious if anyone has a good idea how gays were accepted by hippies in the late 60s and early 70s? Someone asked me and I don't actually know.

My Granny was a hippie. She ran away before they became popular and hung around beatniks, nature's children, and finally hippies. She has both good and bad memories of the time and has some amazing stories. But she's said almost nothing about how gays were accepted, though from what she said of the last commune she was at before she got fed up and left back for Texas was that women were pretty much expected to take care of men's needs and men not into women (unless asexual) were put on a special diet to correct their sexuality. From what she says I figure they wouldn't have accepted a lesbian at all (not unless she was willing to have sex with men anyway).

When I told Granny I was a lesbian she was uncomfortable at first. I didn't press her on what she was thinking so it's possible she just worried on how I'd be treated if people (especially in the Bible Belt) knew, but I got the impression she was really disappointed I wasn't going to get a husband and start cranking out the kids. She adjusted after awhile. It's also possible that maybe she's ok with someone being gay she was just not so ready to see ME (her grandaughter who spent years living with her) as gay. (I know she's Christian, too, and you won't find many Christians in East Texas accepting of gays--but OTOH when I was going through a neopagan phase she was fully accepting of that, so maybe that's not an issue.)

I have talked to a few aging hippies who remained hippies and read a book by a hippie and some (and the book) had a strong inclinatino to see sex as between a man and a woman. One aging guy thought gay men had "a fetish" and seemed to look down on them to me. (I haven't talked to any of these people in over 10 years so I can't ask them now.)

OTOH, rainbows seem to be a symbol shared by hippies and gay culture alike and I can't help but wonder how they interacted in like NYC and San Francisco.

I also read some feminist articles from the 70s (like in the book Sisterhood is Powerful) and it seemed to me that some of them treated sexual orientation as a POLITICAL orientation. That is, a lesbian was seen as more rejecting men and the patriarchy and creating womyn's culture (or retreating from the fight depending on how they felt about it) rather than a woman who was attracted to other women and may have felt fine interacting with men, as just an example. But I have no idea how common such a view was.

So was anyone here alive then and out? How did hippies treat you? Or do you know any who experienced them?

I'm just curious. Thanks mile:

[pellaz]

keep in mind the gay population maybe 6% max, not a big influence. things just started back then.

"1969 Stonewall riots are generally considered the starting point of the modern gay liberation"
~1970 was the start if gay pride
the hippies have decayed into the nanny generation

look where n america is now:
-a whole generation of people > age of 40; all anit gay
-the great republican religion, the fusion of government, religion, morality
-the war on terror to distract citizens as their incomes, prospects and retirements become dim
-the general support of the continuos war.

[gilhooly]

I was born in 1946 so I'm probably the guy you are looking for. Hippies utterly ignored gays. I preferred the idea of sex with men from around 12 (1958). Of course I utterly ignored gays. The word gay came into English usage around 1974-75. I never discussed gay anything for the same reason I never discussed the internet. The concepts didn't exist.

On a personal level I always felt acceptable to all my friends before I thought about homosexuality. The reason I felt acceptable is all my friends liked to jerk off like I did. I assumed jerking off was a straight act since all men do it. In 1959 I told all my friends I knew how to do it. They obviously approved since they jerked off with me. As far as I knew homosexuality hadn't been invented. I had sex with all types of guys and everyone seemed to enjoy it. When the word gay was introduced everyone was forced to take sides. We had to say we were gay or straight. I was pissed since my choice was now limited to gays. Before that I just lied to have orgasms with guys and all guys seemed to be enjoying orgasms. I thought the addition of a new label was a bad idea. I liked it better when we all thought of ourselves as guys. As a kid we would all show off our erections to prove how manly we were becoming. I lived on the island of Manhattan which is considered rather gay--NOW--- but not in the fifties, sixties or early seventies. All bars were loud and noisy and loaded with young men and girls. If I was sitting at a bar and some guy pressed his erection into my back I assumed he was interested in me and responded. Since the word didn't exist he didn't ask me if I was gay and I didn't ask him if he was gay. Like traditional men we simply had sex together.

I had one unusual problem. I owned a Rambler with seats that turned into a bed. Every Friday and Saturday people borrowed my car keys. I was jealous that my car was having a better sex life than I was.

This will sound stupid but I always thought I would grow up and fall in love with a girl since no one talked about an alternative. I assumed all guys were straight and I was a late bloomer. One very important fact and I hope you remember this. I never met a homosexual or anyone who was homophobic. I never saw gay porn of any sort before 1976.

Gays and right wing homophobes made a joint debut in the mid seventies. I don't know which came first. I heard that some "gays" were rioting downtown and some antigay guys were rioting as well. We all assumed the antigay guys were from New Jersey where all the assholes of the world lived. The drinking age in NY was 18 and 21 in NJ. On weekends every asshole from Jersey came to NYC looking for fights. They were doing that in the early fifties. I now live in NJ and know NJ is the natural homeland of homophobes who are either black or Italian for reasons known only to God. NJ probably has the highest % of gays but since I don't want to be attacked by blacks or young Italians, I keep my mouth shut.

I thought of myself as a hippie since I was always stoned on marijuana, hash, LSD or mescaline until around 1975. In 1976 I made the great gay migration to San Francisco and happily realized I wasn't going to turn straight. That was the most exciting period of gay history in US. Every night you could see live shows on TV from the Continental Baths in NY. In SF the bath house scene was happening in most parks.

Like every other gay guy I got hit by a runaway train called AIDS. I no longer wanted to be gay, hippie or even counter cultural. Reagan and his friends took over and I felt like a whipped dog waiting to go to another funeral or drag around a quilt.. An awful lot of left-wing people seemed to just disappear. I felt like fighting was like dying and I was going nowhere. Clinton gave some life back to left-wing. He woke me up. I started collecting petitions, nominations etc. in local politics. I was pleased that gay guys had blackmailed Congress into passage of DADT. A young guy asked what gay blackmail was. I said I tell the Democratic Party I feel sick and don't show up for meetings.

You gays had better remember gays are the Democratic Party base. We don't show up the Democrats can kiss their asses goodbye. Virtually everyone working door to door in NJ is either gay or lesbian. No straights and almost no one under 40.

Like most guys I despised the women's movement when it first appeared. It was composed almost solely of lesbians who hated men and creepy women like Betty Friedan or Gloria Steinem. Two standins for Josef Stalin. I thought they were stupid bra burners and voted against the ERA. I was disgusted by Roe v. Wade decision which forbid fathers from having a say in the birth of their own children. I despise how women took over teaching and made sure they always got custody of children. I feel that women destroyed the basic family structure of this country.

I know that sounds awful. But I truly believe in equal rights for women, If a daughter of mine was disqualified from something she sought I would go crazy and punch someone in the face. My nagging problem since the beginning was their disgusting hatred of men, I would listen to NOW meetings on TV. Women encouraged other women to determine the sex of their babies. Then use your constitutional right to abortion to abort male babies. NOW happily announced their members had 72% female babies, I was profoundly offended that NOW encouraged genocide for men.

I understand women never bought into that bullshit. But first impressions last a long time. I would really like to see a WE LIKE MEN demonstration by women to remove the bad taste left in our mouth by the filthy bitches who started NOW. I know they are gone. Remind me that women still like women. At 65 I actually think women like men better than men do. Say it out loud and we might get better leaders. Currently all candidates must be approved by Wall St or they receive no media attention. I dare you to name the one declared gay guy running in 2012. He is not approved of by NY and has no reason to live according to the 5 media companies who dominate America. We could have great gay leaders since they do exist. Unfortunately NY believes homosexualism is a form of Naziism. There are less than 10,000 who own or control America.

PLEASE POST ON THIS SITE> I AM REALLY CURIOUS ABOUT YOUR OPINIONS.

[OrphanPip]

Gays had some visibility with the Beatniks, with Ginsberg obviously being a public figure over the obscenity trial in the 50s surrounding the homosexual and drug content of Howl. Another prominent Beat figure, Burroughs, was also gay. Jack Kerouac was not gay but he did hang around with gay men like Ginsberg. There was an aspect of their anti-establishment movement that perhaps did not affirm homosexuality, but embraced it in a way as a form of rebellion against the status quo.

If you want gay subculture in the late 60s you have to look at Andy Warhol and the Factory group, besides Warhol's likely homosexuality, there were transsexuals, drag queens, and other gays who congregated in his artistic circles.

[Pix]

Thanks so much for the replies! mile:

And gilhooly, I wanted you know I appreciated such a long explanation as it helped me understand changes in previous decades, and I read every word. Thanks for taking the time to share all that. mile: