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Hell in a Handbasket
#1
Why must this country go to hell in a handbasket? I mean our next president no matter what will throw us in to some sort of problem. With Obama we'll just get more debt and the oh so great "Obamacare". With Romney we'll get thrown back culturally a few years not to mention he'll probably be just like a Bush clone. It's all screwed up. If any of you were following the Rep. GOP race you could tell just how wackey the candidates were not to mention how farfetched their ideals were, but in the same sense the same is happening to the Dem. party as well just not on the Rep. level. Have they lost common sense or something? Really I think the creation of a new party is in order, one with more brains and sense to actually do something, but that's a lost cause considering the majority of votes go to the jackass and the elephant. Just for once I'd wish for a leader that'd do something right for us all and not just for their own party and political adgenda.
#2
We have a two party system, anyone trying to go outside of those lines is not going to get enough votes to matter. There is no ideal choice, hasn't been for a few decades so take your pick.

Big Government or Big business
Constitutional rights or Minority rights
Taxes or War

We can't have it all the way we want it, so it falls to each of us to decide which means more to us and, which we can live with taking a loss on and, in the end, even if the whole of the LGBT community voted the same (which we won't), we are a small minority in this country and, the majority will win, leaving us to deal with what comes or get out.

A third party would take a few votes from each, but in the end, one of the two would still win.
#3
LoveOnTheRocks Wrote:... Obama we'll just get more debt and the oh so great "Obamacare".
i think you are being too harsh on the Obama.
-The Bush legacy left Obama with little to work with. There were two unfinished wars and a general international political mess to clean up. The economy was ignored for 8years. The american people were governed by fear and despair. Just came to the realization their way of life has peaked and things are on the dwn slope
-Obamacare is the best we can do with the huge medical industrial technological corperate influence. If you havnt figured it out money speaks very loud. Keep in mind; with the private insurance companies, you spend 6mo cleaning up things for your 2week hospital stay. In a recession, where i live the only construction you see is them building new hospitals, there must be lots of money there. I dotn see any doctors living a down life style.
-You complain about debt when we had two wars going on half way across the planet for the Bush administration. some one has to pay for that.
LoveOnTheRocks Wrote:... creation of a new party is in order
the issue with a third party is there will never be a consensus and no clear majority until two of the parties have joined forces and beat up the third.
#4
Obamacare alone is enough to keep me from voting for him. I will not be told I have to have heath insurance or pay a penalty for choosing not to have it. Add to that what he wants to do with my second amendment rights, giving people far too long on unemployment - sure they stay unemployed, why work if you can get paid to not work? (And that by the way is the tax dollars of the working people paying for those two years.)

As bad as potentially loosing some of my gay rights and, the threat to other minority right presented by Romney, it beats Obama in my mind. No I didn't vote for Bush, and usually do vote Democrat, but I didn't vote for Obama and, this time I will vote Romney just to help get Obama out of there. In my mind anything has got to be better for the nation as a whole than more Obama.
#5
the sad things is there is housewife or small business owner who could run this country better understand what living on a budget means....our government officials spend much of their term trying to get in good with company's so that they have a fat pay check waiting for them when they are out of office, the American government could fix the health care system if they wanted to but they don't want to piss off big business, they could get us out of debt if they wanted to parents do it all the time when they look at their children and say we cant afford those shoe we have rent to pay and food to put on the table, if every day Americans can live on a small budget why cant they government fix its problems and the nations
#6
Blue Wrote:... I will not be told I have to have heath insurance or pay a penalty for choosing not to have it ...
you are required to have auto insurance, if you drive. i guess your not expected to off yourself if you dont have health care than again fall down almost dead in the street and you expect who to clean up the mess.
serious:
there are a lot of situations that could happen, for a lot of people, call it health insurance or obama-care but something has to pay the bill.

better you than me.
#7
Blue Wrote:Obamacare alone is enough to keep me from voting for him. I will not be told I have to have heath insurance or pay a penalty for choosing not to have it. Add to that what he wants to do with my second amendment rights, giving people far too long on unemployment - sure they stay unemployed, why work if you can get paid to not work? (And that by the way is the tax dollars of the working people paying for those two years.)

As bad as potentially loosing some of my gay rights and, the threat to other minority right presented by Romney, it beats Obama in my mind. No I didn't vote for Bush, and usually do vote Democrat, but I didn't vote for Obama and, this time I will vote Romney just to help get Obama out of there. In my mind anything has got to be better for the nation as a whole than more Obama.

Can it really be that you have not heard of Romneycare? :confused: (In case you haven't then Romneycare is considered the forerunner of Obamacare. Heck the policy came from a right wing think tank as an alternate to "Hillary Care" and was said to promote responsibility over welfare by forcing people to buy insurance. Obama pretty much tapped the same plan, something even many Republicans blasted Romney for when they were still fighting for the POTUS candidacy nomination. Interesting enough Republicans praised the plan and liberals condemned it as heartless until Obama ran with it and then both sides changed their position to the opposite it had been on.)

And btw, here's a tip: don't listen to the NRA, they just love to shake people down for money by scaring them about gun rights or something similarly sensationalist (for example they once spread something like, "World's tyrants to meet on American soil to take away your guns! Sign this useless petition and send us more money!" in response to another humdrum UN vote in NYC that would be in no way binding to the US even if the Useless Nations could've made a clear decision, which of course they didn't). I, and many other gun owners, don't trust them at all (I much prefer the Second Amendment Foundation). (NRA members who teach gun safety and all that are fine, I'm talking about the bureaucracy that plays politics at the expense of our rights as well as forever seeking to enrich its coffers, and btw, the only gun control I heard of Obama passing as POTUS was backed by the NRA as well, other than that Obama has loosened gun restrictions rather than tightening them).
#8
And, last I knew RomCare was not being pushed, he knows it won't fly. Obama doesn't seem to get that forced health insurance flies in the face of so many freedoms, religion (some religions do not believe in going to doctors at all) Basic freedom of choice, pursuit of happiness - if I have to pay for something I do not need or want, I'm not going to be able to pursue my happiness in building my boat, going on a vacation to the Keys, or even going out to eat if I want to.

Sure society need laws and rules, but not that kind of laws. We also don't need to be rewarding people for NOT working. Yes a short term bit of public aid, and help for single parents, disabled, elderly and the like but, WTF is with giving able bodied, sound of mind Jane and Joe 2 years of unemployment - especially in right to work states that give you that unemployment even if you QUIT?
#9
Blue Wrote:And, last I knew RomCare was not being pushed, he knows it won't fly. Obama doesn't seem to get that forced health insurance flies in the face of so many freedoms, religion (some religions do not believe in going to doctors at all) Basic freedom of choice, pursuit of happiness - if I have to pay for something I do not need or want, I'm not going to be able to pursue my happiness in building my boat, going on a vacation to the Keys, or even going out to eat if I want to.

Sure society need laws and rules, but not that kind of laws. We also don't need to be rewarding people for NOT working. Yes a short term bit of public aid, and help for single parents, disabled, elderly and the like but, WTF is with giving able bodied, sound of mind Jane and Joe 2 years of unemployment - especially in right to work states that give you that unemployment even if you QUIT?
So the fix to the health system is if you don't have insurance and don't have the cash, you should be refused medical help. I believe if we got rid of the frivolous lawsuits not only in medical care, which is why doctor's malpractice insurance is so high, but in all the differant trades and bussinesses. Wining a lawsuit against mac donalds cause someone is stupid enough to put the hot coffee they just bought between their legs while driving a car is just plain nuts. There is a time for attorney's but if you look at court dockets at each case it becomes insane, James
[Image: images?q=tbn%3AANd9GcRz-Six7p24KDjrx1F_V...A&usqp=CAU]
#10
yep government just sucks.


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