Jesus

[OrphanPip]

It is far more widely accepted that the body was re-buried, or the empty tomb was mistaken for the one that Christ was actually buried in.

And once again I have to take issue with your characterization of the evidence involved. There are several possible versions of the body theft hypothesis. For example, necromancy/death rituals were commonly practised in the period, and grave robbing of new bodies is accounted for in Roman Law. It doesn't have to be the disciples involved, any number of people could have stolen the body for any number of reasons. Matthew's is the only account to say the tomb was guarded, and he is already mentioning the accusation by the Jews that the Disciples themselves stole the body. It is likely the body disappeared, but that they didn't know how. Mark is by far the earliest account, and it mentions no angels, but only a young man in the tomb when the women arrive. In John the story includes a sighting of Jesus at the tomb by Mary! Moreover, Mark does not mention Joseph of Arimathea being a follower of Jesus, this becomes an added detail in later versions. Joseph could have simply moved Jesus' body, after the Sabbath, but before the women came to visit the tomb. After all, the tomb was apparently near his home.

And frankly, the premise that the disciples were hypocritical manipulators (which is improbable) is still more reliable as a premise than God existing (and that he so happens to be the God of the nt).

A body being stolen from a grave is an unusual occurrence, but it is one that has been proven to happen. Miracles, on the other hand, are more than simply unlikely.

[Zennyboy]

Another religious thread... surely this should actually be in the religious section of the forum and not here?

the contours of believe and faith are two different things, and until people start thinking outside the box so to speak, the messages will always be twisted from the original scriptures

[rover330]

Actually, the existence of avatars in human civilization is hardly outrageous. Jehovah, Christ, Mohammed, Buddha, Zoroaster. Nor is the controversery over which is correct, nor the wars.

My question is why can't everyone just chill and let everyone come to their own conclusions? without trying to tell anyone else what to do

guess that is not really the pattern of human history

[rover330]

good point... I still maintain there is a fine line between religion and sexuality

[Zennyboy]

Actually, the existence of avatars in human civilization is hardly outrageous. Jehovah, Christ, Mohammed, Buddha, Zoroaster. Nor is the controversery over which is correct, nor the wars.

My question is why can't everyone just chill and let everyone come to their own conclusions? without trying to tell anyone else what to do

guess that is not really the pattern of human history

What ive said in all these religious debates and threads.

No mans or womans faith and belief is EVER THE SAME. Everyone has their own ways of breaking things down, their own way of understanding teachings or guidance.

The sad thing is watching people take things to the extreme and watching it as they hurt others.

Keep what you believe to yourself, have faith where you choose to put faith, and learn what you choose to learn.

[rover330]

that a historical figure referred to as Jesus Christ existed sometime during the reign of the Roman emperor Tiberius is pretty much accepted as historical fact. that a Roman governor named Pontius Pilate who pissed Tiberius off and wound up being exiled as the governor of a podunk province at the edge of the Empire as payback is pretty much a given as well. whether or not Jesus Christ was the Son of God remains to be settled and continues to be the subject of great controversy. My guess would be that his legacy would probably be to him a subject of great sadness.

[Geminize]

Originally posted by ReasonableJeff
If we are able to give up a prejudice against miracles, it seems to me that the resurrection of Jesus is the best explanation of the facts.

Why on Earth would we give up a "prejudice" against miracles? If we accept miracles, then there is no need for facts at all.

One of the reasons I left the church in my teens was that I realized that there are people of many religions who are equally convinced of the truth of their own faith. People all over the world for centuries have experienced supposed visions, epiphanies, and miracles which they have ascribed to Jesus, Mohamed, Buddha, Kali, Zeus, Freya, Ramtha, etc. Several of these religions have historical documents used to support their teachings. I believe the common denominator of these spiritual experiences is simply our imperfect human perceptions. Our brains misfire, we perceive an experience we are unable to explain, and we interpret that perception within our cultural context.

Mix in some charismatic leaders, random geo/political influences, bake for a thousand years, and viola! You have a major religion.

[Counselor]

good point... I still maintain there is a fine line between religion and sexuality

Srsly? I try to keep a Great Wall of China between the two!

[Parker]

[COLOR="DarkGreen"]Just pointing out that regardless of evidence, which i don't doubt there are some, Jesus taught about love. If I remember correctly some guy came up and asked what the most important commandment was and Jesus said to love God with all you heart soul and mind, and the second greatest commandment is to love your neighbor as yourself. that is just one example, so idk what Bible this guy is reading but his statement is as backward as they come.
note: this comment was meant for the original post. whatever was written in between here and there that my comment has nothing to do with I apologize. [/COLOR]