Help with social anxiety / loneliness (not asking for it)

[Hayden]

Loneliness and difficulty meeting new people seems to be a frequently brought up issue here. I thought I'd present this as a resource to those who identify with such concerns.

http://www.succeedsocially.com/mainconcepts

I deal with fairly severe social anxiety and have done so my whole life. I can usually handle social situations which are structured, expectations for behavior are clearly defined and there's little expectation for interaction with other people, like school or eating in a restaurant. But when things are more free form I start to freak and panic, so I generally avoid "hanging out" or parties like a rat. Because of this behavior I've quit several jobs (in moments of panic), intentionally severed contact with friends who generally cared for me, and spent almost most every weekend of my adult life sitting at home feeling sorry for myself (not to mention the lack of any intimate relationship so far, which I KNOW several people can relate to).

The real sonofabitch about all this is that social anxiety causes a certain type of angry, embittered circular thinking in which the subject inflates his or her ego so as to avoid the discomfort of suffering other people's perceived judgements about them.

In other words, I've become a real bastard.

I've spent a lot of this day reading through this website and it offers some really terrific advice for a guy like me. It uses a lot of tough love, which after experiencing some coddling therapy that promotes a certain victim mentality (only in my direct experience), this was really nice to read.

The gist is something like: Stop thinking you're better than everyone else. You are not a special little snowflake. No one gives a shit that you're sad a lot. You want friends, then talk to someone.

Seems very obvious, but sometimes that's what you need to here.

Anyway, if anyone relates to the above, go ahead and check it out. I'm enjoying it.

[HomeagainNYC]

This is not a reply to your post per se, since you did not ask for one, but an add on, if you will.

Your post outlines an important part of the human condition; how we recognize and deal with our insecurities - if - we choose to acknowledge them. One needs only read the threads of the forum, as you point out, to observe this condition.

This might be a GLBT forum but the insecurities, which are revealed here, are no more amplified - than are the ones to be found in the rest of the world's population - albeit, the subject matter may take on different forms.

All of us, and I do mean all of us - have insecurities in one form or another. Since the dawn of civilized man we have been both plagued and inspired by our insecurities.

There are basically two types of personalities, ones that believe that their insecurities define them and ones who don't. This forum is microcosmic of the two personalty types.

I am inspired by the ones who won't let themselves be defined by their insecurities; the ones who will put in the work to reordered how insecurities - influence their life choices.

I applaud you for your post and your willingness/ability, to not be defined by your insecurities. The work is never easy and at times down right painful and disheartening, but the rewards are astonishing and life changing.

From what I have read in your posts you are charming, witty, intelligent, a risk taker (think the kiss) and a seeker of your own inner truth. Bravo. Keep up the good work.

[bakalove]

For a long time I would be the quiet kid who barely said anything and just listened to conversations. In the last few months I've been training myself out of my old mindset which was basically this; "OMG what if I say something stupid or it doesnt come out right???" But after noticing that people dont always say things correctly or mean it in the right way often and nobody pays much attention to it I've shed that way of thinking and gone to the "No shame no game" motto. In the right group of people I can take control of the conversation and get everyone laughing. It's a great feeling knowing im not the quiet one anymore, and even when I say something wrong or I stutter for some random reason nobody notices and if they do I make fun of myself which makes them laugh even more. But in general if you dont let yourself feel judged by the people around you, you can shed that anxiety just train your mind to work away the anxiety.

[trywait]

i waaaaay more a wallflower than a social butterly

[SolemnBoy]

I have minor social anxiety (nothing severe though) but I don't think I'm "better" than most people, I think I'm "different" from most people. That could be a delusion as well but either way "different" is pretty neutral and doesn't really imply anything good or bad.

As far as insecurities go, naturally they don't define who you are as a person, but I'm a lot more comfortable acknowledging them. Once you do that it's a lot easier to discuss; people start acknowledging their own as well and soon you just have a circle of friends where everyone knows each person is different from the other and accept/joke about eachother's virtues and flaws. I like that.

[pellaz]

.. spent almost most every weekend of my adult life sitting at home feeling sorry for myself ... certain type of angry, embittered circular thinking ... I've become a real bastard ...

if you want friends you got to play nice. always treat people a little better than they treat you

[MisterTinkles]

Im happy to see you have brains and know how to use them!

Most people would just start blaming everybody else and find any other excuses as to why they are this way, and start making up "diseases" and bullshit like that.

You are taking responsibility for you, and I could hug you for that!! Its rare anyone takes responsibility for themselves anymore....they have to blame somebody ELSE for their personal problems, which pisses me off to no end.

Hooray for you!!!

You get five gold stars

[Steve1860]

Hayden,

I find your post to be thoughtful and direct. I think that you have made many good points as have others who responded. I did look at the link you provided...didn't read app of it, but got the gist as I have about 50 years of experience of social anxiety or one degree or another.

After a very long hiatus, I have opened the door that i had very carefully sealed a decade ago. It brings up all of the issues I had when I was younger and the issues that I had meeting new people that I was interested in.

In some ways, you are presenting the "pick yourself up by the bootstraps" attitude/theory. I am wondering if you are taking into account, people that have had lifelong serious issues of anxiety, social phobias leading to agoraphobia. When you don't have a good support system in place...even thought he "work" is ultimately done by you, it is sometimes unbearably difficult to be able to make progress.

I, for instance, don't particularly have issues meeting new people that I an NOT interested in (romantically/sexually). Unfortunately, when I am attracted to a guy that way, all of my insecurities and inadequacies con "front and center"...and in force. I have seen more shrinks, therapists...taken more scripts that I can even remember over the years to be in the very same boat that I was 30 years ago...only worse. I do not think I am better than others...I usually think i am not as good as others. Yes, I have many things to offer...most of which have nothing to do with a relationship issue. As far as the relationship issue, I do have positive things to offer (at least I think the traits are good)...traits of honesty, sincerity, caring, empathy, willingness to open myself up to love...thus opening myself up to heartache (which has basically been my "love history").

Being inherently shy and never learning the "dating games" (I hate games), I have always failed at relationships. My longest "relationship" lasted 10 days (a number of them in fact) and they were fast and intense and ended as fast as they started.

No, I am not looking for "analysis" here...I am just looking back at my history and how I feel today and relaying it as it pertains to your post (hopefully).

I am not sure that you are taking into account real psychological/medical issues that in fact could be a brain chemical imbalance causing some of this behavior. Just as much as a thyroid condition can reek havoc on your body...a brain chemical imbalance can reek havoc on your mind and how you deal with different things such as meeting other people or dating.

I hope that this give you pause to think about other very real issues that aren't just "personality issues" that can be "fixed" by changing your thought patterns.

I will reiterate, just so you know that I DO think you have thought through allot of this and have articulated it very well. I am sure that the things you have brought up are true for you and you ARE a very intelligent and thoughtful man...especially for your age.

Thanks for the post,

Steven

[Hayden]

Thank you all for your responses and contributions. This is a very interesting topic to me so I really enjoyed reading everyone’s different points of view.

Hooray for you!!!

You get five gold stars

Awesome! I needed something to hang on my fridge.

I have minor social anxiety (nothing severe though) but I don't think I'm "better" than most people, I think I'm "different" from most people.

SolemnBoy, I wouldn’t hesitate for a second in thinking that I was better than most people if my hair could do what yours can.

I applaud you for your post and your willingness/ability, to not be defined by your insecurities. The work is never easy and at times down right painful and disheartening, but the rewards are astonishing and life changing.

From what I have read in your posts you are charming, witty, intelligent, a risk taker (think the kiss) and a seeker of your own inner truth. Bravo. Keep up the good work.

Thank you for your kind words MissingNYC (the kiss is getting easier btw ). Though I’m not sure if I completely deserve the whole “not being defined by your insecurities” thing. The weird thing about insecurities of any type is that they feel like something you should be able to control or will away with rational thinking, but as Steve correctly points out that’s not always the case. Sometimes I feel acknowledging the insecurities is, in a way, defining myself by them. You know what I mean?

My thought process goes back and forth between “I really need help with this” to “Oh, get over yourself. There’s nothing wrong with you. You’re being a child.” The latter type of thinking is exemplified by original post.

@Steve1860:

I’ve taken a while to write back on this thread because what you wrote did indeed give me serious pause. I’ve spent much of the day thinking about it. I don’t think my thoughts are fully developed on the matter yet, but oh well. Let’s give a try. Apologies in advance if I’m not very articulate in the upcoming text.

I feel I should clarify a couple things, even though I suspect that what I think needs clarification probably doesn’t. Even so…

I am in no way suggesting (or perhaps I was suggesting, but I take it back now) that social phobias are never psychological/medical issues.

(I should point out again that I think you know I wasn’t implying this as evidenced by end of your post mentioning that what I am talking about may be true for me)

(I also feel I should point out how goddamn obsessive I’m being about over clarifying myself because I’m always afraid of being misunderstood and unintentionally saying something rude. Overthinking is exhausting).

My therapist has used the same analogy when she was trying to convince me to get on meds (though I believe she used cancer, not a thyroid condition). I never agreed to the meds. I expressed my reticence to be on medication several times to her but she would not relent, almost as if she was saying “If you’re not here to get on meds then why are wasting my time?” It was the reason I stopped going. I just wanted to talk, dag nabbit.

The other point I want to clarify is the “I’m better than everyone else” issue, which SolmenBoy also brought up.

I would just like to point out that I don’t actually think I’m better than everyone else, but the opposite (which is also not true). I’ve found myself in a place, mentally, where I intentionally find things to judge and dismiss people for so as to avoid being dismissed by them first, which I see as inevitable. This defense mechanism has caused my ability to enjoy anything to calcify and shut down.

Any opportunity to socialize (or enjoy being alive) is instantly met with an angry little voice in my head that says “Eh, what’s the point? Every one else there is just going to be some fucking asshole. Just stay home, you don’t need anybody.” That’s the fiction, the "fuck everyone" mentality. The reality is that I desperately want to be accepted by other people. I can also admit that I’m probably pretty jealous of the “social butterflies” out there so I dismiss them when I can.

My point being that the "pick yourself up by the boot straps" method isn't an appropriate, realistic, or compassionate response or solution to genuine social anxiety, but it may be a strategy to help remedy the side effects of SA (anger, bitterness, false sense of superiority) for some people.

I hope that makes sense. I’m not sure if I still necessarily agree with all that I wrote in the first post.

I was on campus yesterday sitting around watching people mingle, talk and hold hands and I was hating every last one of them when I discovered that website and it seemed to say what I felt I needed to hear. I spend 40 hours a week on campus and have done so for the last two years and I've hardly spoken to anyone for more than a “can I get a piece of paper” or a mandatory group project. Although I’m able to busy myself for the majority of the time with work, it’s still hard not to start feeling a little down sometimes.

I hope that all makes sense, and I hope I didn’t misconstrue anything you said. Your post really made me think, thank you.

It really wasn’t my intention to spill all this out when I started this thread, but oh well, that’s what I’ve decided to do now.

Thanks again for everyone who contributed.

[Steve1860]

Hi Hayden,

Just because I am paranoid and I don't want you to think that I was judging you. I have been through allot over the years and I was hoping to impart a bit of my experiences through my post. I did not take offense to anything that you said, but I just wanted you to think of possibilities that you might not have considered.

I have not followed any previous posts that you have made, so I am going by this one, but you are truly thoughtful. By your addition in your last reply, it lets me know that you are just that and going through allot of self-discovery. I am glad that you have not shut the door on others input. It is very good to learn from as many people as you can. Everyone has gone through things to get them to where they are currently...a compilation of life's experiences. There is both good and bad and happy and sad experiences in all of that.

Because I have had a history that has been unsuccessful in the romantic department, it might give me a different point of view than others might have. By no means am I saying that I have the market cornered on unsuccessful relationships. I know that there are other people that have had worse experiences than I.

I am glad that you left your therapist..she sounds like a "pill pusher"...thinking that everything can be solved by pills. I am not saying that some aren't necessary, especially if there is a physiological imbalance at play. Wanting to talk is very important in therapy (and in general). It is because you "hear" what has been running around in your brain and it is thus processed by your brain...I hope that makes sense. I have received some of my biggest insights through therapy while talking about issues that I have or have had.

In my case, taking medication has helped me to be able to deal more productively with many things. Unfortunately, it has taken years of experimentation trying one med after the other. Since everyone is different and their bodies react differently to medications, it is often difficult to find something that works on the first try. I can give you 2 examples of this. Prozac works very well for some people..for me it caused suicidal ideation when there was nothing going on in my life that would have caused those types of thoughts. After I called my shrink and told him that I was holding a razor blade above my wrists, he said to stop that med. Those thoughts diminished quick quickly. I was quite surprised because I always touted myself of being extremely self-aware and this just came upon me fast and "out of the blue. I recently had a similar very intense experience with Cymbalta. It did help me have more energy and took me out of the continual funk that I have been in for years. Unfortunately, it also heightened my anxiety and paranoia. At the height of this, I was "barricaded" in my house with my guns loaded and carrying them around with me so that, just in case one of the crisis lines that I had called followed their protocol and had the authorities sent to my house. My intent was not to hurt anyone else, but I know, "I wasn't going to be taken alive". You see...I have major issues with remaining in control. I couldn't have someone putting me in for observation in a locked ward of some hospital. It triggered that "fight or flight" syndrome. That is very powerful. I actually figured the medication connection myself and stopped taking it. Although I had a very hard time that day (in particular), within a couple of days, those "symptoms" diminished. Now it is on my list of medication allergies. Please don't think that all medications are bad or give you this type of reaction, but unfortunately psych meds in particular are just not understood very well and that combined with having the brain not understood very well can create issues like those that I have described.

Having allot of the issues that I have and having them for so long has made me think that I am "damaged" and not worth the effort by someone else when it comes to a relationship. That is a multifaceted issue.

I, as you, did not plan to reveal this much information when I started this reply. My openness has and does get me into "trouble" still.

I truly hope that you can work through these thought and questions in your mind. I would hate to see a beautiful young man like yourself have to go through what I have gone through for the past 30 years.

Try to have a good support system in place and don't, "off the cuff" poo poo medications as a possible option to help you. You might be able to only have to take then for a while and not for a lifetime.

Continue to question and observe and work on yourself...with or without a therapist. You can work through this and be much better off in the end.

If you ever want to talk...feel free to contact me. Maybe, I can add points of view that you haven't considered yet. I certainly don't have all of the answers or I would be living "happily ever after" in an LTR.

I truly wish you the best.

Steven