Bug Chasers

[Corsac]

I know a guy who is positive (Adam) and he told me that a guy kept trying to "catch it" from him (Barry). It pretty much ruined Adam's life and he is still mad at the guy who passed it on to him, now Barry wants Adam to do the same to him? That's pretty messed up!

What's even worse is that I dated Barry not long before finding this out...

That is pretty messed up, I bet it made you think a lot about the whole thing after finding this all out.

[HomeagainNYC]

I have been aware of this issue for many years – it’s by no means a new phenomenon.

Due to organizations I’ve been involved with; I have counseled “bug chasers” and have heard it all. I couldn’t find a shred of truth in any of their dogma.

The arrogance of this type of personality - is so blatantly insolent - to the people who fought and died, and continue to do so, to keep this disease in the spotlight, so others may one day be spared its misery.

[MisterTinkles]

"Misperceptions" my fat ass!!!

These morons need a baseball bat to the head!! Because apparently they need something to kickstart some braincells into actually WORKING!!




And this can be said for ANY disease. Ive heard of people wanting to get cancer, so they can be taken "seriouslY' as human beings. I mean, REALLY.....if you are in such a hurry to die....put a gun to your head and pull the trigger. Save us all a lot of expense in being charged MORE for healtcare because these douches feel sorry for themselves.

Save the money, drugs, and Dr visits for people who DONT want to be sick and kill themselves!!
Dont expect me to have sympathy for these selfish, egotistcal ingrates who dont care about anyone or anything except thier own personal pity parties!!!

[Spades]

That is pretty messed up, I bet it made you think a lot about the whole thing after finding this all out.

It did, it was over Christmas/New Years when I found out, and my then boyfriend and I were too scared to do anything until we both got tested, I then became more aware of it and went for tests more often. I also learned that even after tests, barebacking was a biiig risk.

[Aeneas]

the main problem here is not really that these morons want to catch the disease, but rather that they wouldn't think twice about "gifting" another unsuspecting person with it.


and i am by no means well versed in all the ins and outs of HIV, but i read its not even accurate to assume that just because you are infected, you can have sex with other HIV+ people unprotected and everything will be fine. i understand that different people may have different strains of the virus which if passed on could render the person's current anti-viral cocktail useless.

[BobInTampa]

PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE STOP JUDGING!

I have been living with hiv for more than 20 years - (and i've worked in group therapy, education and outreach program - so i think i can speak to this subject with a bit more perspective than those bashing folks who identify as "bug chasers." (Note: i contracted the virus from a partner who had the virus but never told me till after i was infected - he told me he was afraid i'd not date/love him if i knew - something that's not uncommon among alot of poz guys who are villified online and in public).

First, some guys who go out of their way to TRY to contract hiv, are displying a self-destructive pattern of behavior. The cause of that behavior can ONLY be determined by a qualified mental health professional - not folks sitting in judgement on a website.

Great, you wouln't knowing seek out poz sex partners with the goal of contracting hiv. Excellent. But again, unless this is an issue that directly impacts YOUR life and health - don't judge.

Another reason some gay men go out of their way to get infected, is because they think that after they get infected, they can just relax and let go of the anxiety that comes with the "are you poz or neg" discussion with potential mates/dates. Again, as twisted as it may seem to you, some guys have more anxiety about getting infected and being able to be intimate - than the fear of what having hiv might do to their lifespan or overall health.

Now, alot of younger guys - and just google the HIV rate among gay/bi men in their 20's - especially black males - and you'll see that many of those infected are on the "down low" and so they are hiding in the closet and finding sexual outlets at places and with guys they will never see again. Also, many demographic groups have underlying issues with using condoms. You'd be amazed!!!! These guys on the DL don't meet men at gay bars - they go to bathhoues, bookstores, cruise locations and engage in sex - without much thought about safer sex.

Now, there's also a LARGE group of guys who, because they didn't see a whole generation die (like those of us who were infected in the 80's and 90's - when the "cocktail" used to treat HIV wasn't available. NOW, there are dozens of combinations of meds that can keep the virus in check and in most cases, allows a person to live a normal lifespan. So, because hiv is no longer a guaranteed death sentence (look at the hiv med ads on websites - they show hot, handsome, muscular young guys - who dont' look like they are "sick." Those ads are targeted to already infected folks - to let them know about treatment options. BUT, many guys see those ads and say, "Hmm, if i get it, i get it - i hate condomes and so, if i get it, i'll just go on meds...and then i don't have to worry about it anymore."

Again, this may not be you, but alot of younger guys (most of us have thought this in the past) think they are invinceable - so doing stupid stuff (like drag racing with strangers, driving 100mph on a motorcycle, drinking and driving - you see where i'm going with this, i hope) isn't uncommon.

In my 20 years being poz i've met or talked to MANY guys who would say after i told them my status, "it's cool, that's not an issue for me." I would say, "Well, it's an issue for me and i don't want to be responsible for infecting you - even if you don't care." THere ARE some positive guys who don't think twice about it. They think, "hey, i was upfront about my status, so he's making an informed decision." Either way, for me, disclosure is, was and will always be my philophy.

And the last group of guys who are "bug chasers" often feel that being poz is just another way to separate themselves from the larger gay community. In many ways, these guys look at being poz in the same way folks who get covered in tattoos and piercings think. It's an addition to their identity. They become part of a special and separte community - they become part of a group. Now, think about guys who are obese. They over eat, they don't show any respect for their health or body - and yet, they can find support and acceptance among other "bears" or members of the gay community who are also obese. We may not understand how a guy could "knowingly do that to himself." He must know that he can die from heart disease, diabetes, high blood pressure and/or stroke - right? Well, some gay men feel that way about hiv. They then are "accepted" into a group of poz guys and not judged because they are poz.

Now, that brings me to my final point. JUDGMENTALISM IN THE GAY COMMUNITY!

Nothing pisses me off more then when a guy uses the word "clean" to describe either THEIR STD status, or what they are looking for in a date/mate. CLEAN? I'm "dirty?" Do you konw how that sounds? Do you know that it's the use of words like that ..that STOP gay/bi men from getting tested every 3 months? They test negative ONCE, and then say to anyone who asks, "Yep, i'm clean, i was tested." It may have been 1, 2 or 3 years ago - but because they FEAR being thought of as "dirty" that they don't get tested. So, in many ways, the gay men who villify poz guys are actually doing more to INCREASE HIV infection - than lowering it.

You don't want to date a poz guy? FINE. Be honest with him and say just that. But, do me - and my fellow poz guys a favor - and take the word/term "clean" out of your profile.

And, one more thing. NO ONE IS PERFECT! We all make mistakes. We all know = or have heard stories of - a guy who was out at a bar, had 1 too many to drink, hooked up with a guy and was too drunk to make an informed decsion about safer sex - and got hiv or an std. It happens! We also know guys who, like me, get in a relationship with a guy who either lied about his status or lied about his last test - and gets infected.

Did you know that according to the CDC, 25-30% of all sexually active bi/gay men are infected with HIV but don't know it? So, next time you're at a gay club, look around. Count ten guys, and know that statistically, 3 of those 10 have HIV and don't know it. .....and YOU DON"T KNOW WHICH OF THOSE 10 GUYS those 3 might be.

So, be a bit more caring with what you say and how you treat hiv poz guys - whether you know they are poz or not. Set an example. Get tested every 3 months if you're sexually active (even if you're practicing safer sex) - because there's no 100% protection from hiv besides absinance.

Hope this helps and puts things into a bit more perspective. Have empathy for those who "chase" hiv. But don't judge them!

[Aeneas]

no one is judging HIV+ people here.


what we are judging is people who chase the disease and those who knowingly pass it on.


i myself am fine with people doing whatever they want to do, unless it harms/affects someone else.

self-distructive behavior? fine. i know what it is to be depressed, down, angry at the world. buy chocolate, get completely wasted in alcohol, do drugs, go to therapy, cut your veins if drawing people's attention is your thing, eat junk food until your arteries explode... but there is NO excuse for putting other people at risk.

no matter how you justify it - its sick, totally unfair, selfish and cruel.

you may go to jail for drink driving or speeding. in many countries now the law stipulates that if you kill someone in the road under the effect of alcohol its considered voluntary manslaughter. thats prison for life.

so if they want to do harm to themselves, fine by me. they want to belong to a group, and LGBT is not good enough for them? join a bridge club.

the problem with these "bug chasers" is that they have so little respect for themselves that it is hard to believe they will have any on others. and i *may* be wrong here (though i doubt it), but these will be the same people who will spread the virus to unsuspecting others. if its "fine" for them to be infected, isnt it "fine" that their partners be infected as well? its all good, right? i saw it on TV, it makes you look muscular... ya....

this is not like a car accident that you will either lose your licence, or be sent to jail, or recover and be driving again in a few months. you will live with this for LIFE. and you will be out there in contact with other people. you will not have your *sex* license removed.

so no. i have no sympathy for these people. they are mentally unstable and dangerous - not only to themselves but to others as well.

[Genersis]

I've been aware of this for a while now.
It pretty much falls under the "If only X, everything would be better." kind of psychosis(perhaps not the right word?). Not uncommon, this specific form though, is.

[Pix]

what we are judging is people who chase the disease and those who knowingly pass it on.

Quoted for truth.

[Pix]

That was a good vid. I wonder how much "attention seeking" also plays into it. For example, a fringe group of girls did all they could to get pregnant, one infertile girl (14 IIRC) was even having sex with winos on the street (as in just met them and didn't even bother to learn their name) and when asked why they've all said something that boiled down to, "Pregnant women get so much attention, people buy them presents and talk about them all the time." IOW, attention & applause (and with luck, their own reality show).

I can only hope that such messed up girls (as messed up in their own way as bug chasers IMO) aren't forced to raise their kids (which they don't want to do anyway) because they're obviously unfit mothers. Though I do recall one also saying she wanted the unconditional love a baby (as opposed to a doll) gives the mom and thinking she should spend some time with a real baby and learn that the "unconditional love" is actually much more likely to be the reverse. :tongue:

Anyway, I don't mean to derail, I'm just saying it makes me wonder if some don't want HIV "for the attention" as well as the other reasons given.

Though in any case I do consider bug chasers to be mentally ill in the extreme, as in worth committal to a psychiatric ward (that is if I thought psychiatry could help them, but I have my doubts about that as it's currently so flawed and the profession dysfunctional).