God is love?

[MisterTinkles]

If it wasn't for that avatar of a cat with a crown which just screams sincerity, I'd think you were being a tad sarcastic here, Mr. Tinkles.

Hmmm, I thought it 'screamed' "look at what some doofus put on my cats head"!!
LOL

Yes, sarcasm is my weapon of choice, but in this case, there is no sarcasm.

This is why I love debating, you get to see things from different perspectives....and this is how we learn that there is more out there than our tiny, minuscule way of thinking.

[HomeagainNYC]

[ZackT]

Whenever people say "I've seen stuff you wouldn't believe" or something to that effect, it just makes me roll my eyes at their attempt to sound more enlightened and tough. It just comes across as a way to inflate their own ego and sound important while slyly putting other people down who haven't gone through or seen what they have, whatever that may be (They pretty much never actually say what it is).

Truth is, I think we've all been through some pretty weird stuff, hard stuff, bad times too. And yea some of us have had it worse than others, but to use it in an argument like that just sounds like the beginning of a "I had it worse...NO I HAD IT WORSE" type of debate.

And stop with the whole "I'm being persecuted, I'm not welcome here" bullshit. Yea, this was a pretty direct and confrontational thread against Religion at the start...by the 1 person who started it. Everyone else is trying to have a peaceful debate about it.

[Wade]

Truth is, I think we've all been through some pretty weird stuff, hard stuff, bad times too. And yea some of us have had it worse than others, but to use it in an argument like that just sounds like the beginning of a "I had it worse...NO I HAD IT WORSE" type of debate.

But if we're going to be fair here, I did in fact have it worse. So.....

Yeah, there's that.


(sarcasm)

[Bowyn Aerrow]

Whenever people say "I've seen stuff you wouldn't believe" or something to that effect, it just makes me roll my eyes at their attempt to sound more enlightened and tough. It just comes across as a way to inflate their own ego and sound important while slyly putting other people down who haven't gone through or seen what they have, whatever that may be (They pretty much never actually say what it is).

As a survivor of a childhood of Ritual 'Satanic' Abuse, I have seen and been put through things that you have never been through.

Aside from being locked in a closet for an excess of two weeks, on more than one occasion, I was beaten, had my blood cut from me for purposes of ritual magics, raped repeatedly and without mercy to please the 'god' Asmodeus', drugged, forced to take an anthame and bury its blade to the hilt inside the chests of dogs, cats, chickens, a few goats and some other critters. Drank from chalices containing all sorts of stuff. You know, breast milk, semen, blood of other members of the circle.

And all of that is part of what I recall, I recall very little between the ages of 8 and 14 - I guess I should assume that the nightmare and night terrors I get were from loving, happy times with pink ponies and rainbows and not assume that from age 8 to age 14 it got a lot worse than in the years before.

On top of those things, I also got to witness - no experience, the presence of malevolent spirit entities. Demons if you will. Yeah sure some of the time may have been an LSD trip (or whatever else was added to the chalice to ease us kids into the ritual). But some of it was not.

I'm most certain up their in your shielded ivory tower with your mommy and daddy protecting you from the horrors of life that you only had to deal with the monsters in the closet and under your bed. I, not so blessed with sane rational parents, had to face the monsters that reside in every dark corner, and worse, the monsters that reside in the dark corners of the human heart.

Now I have no idea if that makes me superior than you or anyone else on this thread, but I do seriously doubt anyone else on this forum has had these "unique" types of experiences. If they have I empathize with them, and my comment about 'melt your brain' does not, and never will apply to them.

And I still believe that if you witnessed these things first hand that it would drive you stark, raving mad - as I know plenty of other ritual abuse victims who were driven mad, insane - driven to split personalities, driven to self destructive behaviors which only by the Grace of God have I survived to this late age with only one suicide under my belt, and only a minor drug and alcohol addiction which I managed to find a way to get out of 18 years ago.

When I say my personal life experiences are what drives me to a belief in God, I am most sincere about that.

And no, I do not feel welcomed here on this thread. It is been made perfectly clear to me that my kind are not welcomed here.

Just like the Christians you all seemingly enjoy to talk about and bring up thread after thread here on Gayspeak don't like your kind.

Every week a new 'anti-christian/Anti-Theist' thread is started and I bite my tongue and allow you all to go blithely around viewing your opinions on religion.

The only reason why I opened my mouth on this thread was because some witty person had this to say:

Don't bring up anything anti-christian.

dvdbrn will get all butthurt and start accusing you of persecuting him lol

And while its true you all are not burning Christians at the stake (Yet, but I have to wonder how many have a secret desire to), from this side of the issue it hurts every time one of you witty characters have something to say about 'Christianity'.

While faith may not be important to you, there are those who rely on faith to survive yet one more day on this earth. There are those who do take offense and or get hurt each time some anti=christian decides to spout off their views and opinions.

Just as you, a homosexual, hates to have someone call you a faggot, or to point out that gays are promiscuous (Oh yeah, sure let me take the sting out of that and say that some ain't that way) Or HIV infested - oh let me reduce the redness there by pointing out that only 1/5th of the gay population has been tested positive... And all of the other stuff that you take as gays being persecuted hurts, and hurts deeply.

Your words, your antichrstian rhetoric hurts others that come here, others who have a faith and who already struggle to reconcile faith with their homosexuality.

The last thing they need is their 'peers' making it twice as hard and hating on their faith.

[bluefox4000]

Well Christians in my experience more often then not do get "Butthurt" when pressed. So I do not even get into it with then.....we both wind up with headaches, lol

Mick

[Wade]

I'm very sorry you went through all of that, David. That's disturbing and sad and I couldn't possibly imagine what that had to be like. I cannot relate to such horrors.

I'm trying not to be a part of these conversations as well, for I constantly second guess the purpose. But, well, you can see how that's turning out.

People are allowed to discuss religion. I'm sorry you don't agree, and your terrible childhood does not mean that no one here should discuss such an important and influential thing as other people's beliefs. For some reason in our culture it's considered taboo and rude, but that's simply hogwash. As you should well know, sexuality is inherent, religion is a choice. As I mentioned earlier, a person's religious beliefs have a profound effect on society. It's fair game. And why are you holding back discussing it?

Every week a new 'anti-christian/Anti-Theist' thread is started and I bite my tongue and allow you all to go blithely around viewing your opinions on religion.

That's very big of you. Thank you.

While faith may not be important to you, there are those who rely on faith to survive yet one more day on this earth. There are those who do take offense and or get hurt each time some anti=christian decides to spout off their views and opinions.

You're religious beliefs do not offend me or hurt my feelings. The fact that my views and opinions, or anyone else's, hurst your feelings is absurd. If you're secure in your beliefs, then what is the harm in discussing it?

And no, I do not feel welcomed here on this thread. It is been made perfectly clear to me that my kind are not welcomed here.

Oh, now don't be such a big girl's blouse. That's not true at all. You're much beloved here, and for good reason. You're always willing to help someone in trouble. You've aided me several times and I am very grateful for the wisdom you've imparted. Speaking for myself at least, I don't hate the Christian, I hate Christianity (see what I did there? That's me being one of those witty people).

Now I have no idea if that makes me superior than you or anyone else on this thread

This made me chuckle. Of course you know that it makes you superior. You're superiority drips in every post. But that's okay too. In terms of experience, I admit you absolutely are superior, to me at least. You're older, you've seen more shit, you've climbed out of more shit, etc. etc. I admire you for it. But other people's opinions and thoughts are valid too. Just, maybe not valid...er as yours?

This is a forum. A place where people discuss things. A place filled with people who have seen the "kindness" of Christianity. It's perfectly acceptable to discuss it.

[bluefox4000]

For the record.....cause I forgot to mention this. As an Atheist. It does not bother me at all what you believe. It's when believers get in my face about what I OUGHT to be doing is when I go off, lol

So if it gives you strength.....good for you.

Mick

[SolemnBoy]

The problem is that in many cases the one getting in someone's face about his/her beliefs is in fact the atheist. Or, well at least where I live. Modern christians in Sweden where most people are non-believers can feel sort of oppressed sometimes, at least socially. We have a christian girl in school who gets into lots of debates because atheists approach her and can't understand how she can believe in a God. She herself, on the other hand, rarely ever brings up her faith.

It goes both ways people. The only way a christian can upset me is by using his faith to defend insane opinions/decisions or by saying something like "I know for sure there is a God". It's not possible to know for sure at this point.

[Brendan]

I dated a girl who was an extremely devout Christian. Her best friend was gay and she didn't care at all when I told her I was bi. Then there's my best friend's mother. She's catholic, goes to mass several times a week, spends all her free time volunteering, lives with her gay son and has a very strong loving relationship with him, never tries to guilt or condemn him over it.

I know that's just anecdotal, but those happen to be two of the most devout Christians I know, and neither of them harbour an once of hatred for homosexuals. A lot of Christians do, but that's due to THEIR particular interpretation of scripture, not because of any bigotry inherent to Christianity itself.