"I think gays are wrong and unnatural...just my opinion though"

[davearoo]

It's not even an 'opinion' in the first place.

Opinions are statements that cannot be proved or disproved, such as 'Chocolate is my favorite flavor of ice cream.' Statements that someone CAN demonstrate as correct or incorrect are facts. Not necessarily TRUE facts, but not opinions. Which means that a statement such as 'Gay people choose to be deviant' is a (false) fact.

[TimeSage]

If someone said that to me I would likely respond with a nasty response, telling them exactly what I think of them, then tack on "But that's just my opinion, don't take it personally" And then stare at them while they process their own tactic.

[Tyrion]

Honestly, it doesn't offend me. If I were offended by every ignorant person I encountered I'd never stop being offended. Basically, as far as I'm concerned anyone can believe whatever they want -- as long as they aren't directly affecting others. If someone honestly thinks that being gay is wrong an unnatural, then that's their prerogative.

[headache]

I think that they don't pay attention for their own tongue, it doesn't really matter for people if their words hurts someone. It's easier to say something stupid than something smart, of course with 0 knowledge.
Personally, I found out that evolution of society gave birth of homo oriention.
Human used to live in bigger and bigger society, in fact we grew to huge ones, and we don't know when, we don't know how, the minority is gays guys.
In science, species which live in society second orientation exists as well.
All things considered evolution sucks

[Bowyn Aerrow]

Humans are animals capable of reasoning, they are not reasoning animals.

The ability to reason, use rational thought exists in nearly all humans. However this is a later addition to the brain and the larger 'animal brain' of emotion and instinctual drives pretty much governs most people.

The people who dislike _____________(fill in the blank) don't do it because of rational thought, they do it due to emotions that they can not control, and in most cases don't care to control.

Dislike/Hatred of a minority is a dislike/hatred of other. For most of human history this 'Us vs Them' mentality meant survival of the tribe. In a world of limited resources hating those different allowed you to carve your niche a little bit different.

You are not dealing with an opinion, you are dealing with a feeling. An emotion.

As such you cannot win this word in rational conversation, the raging animal part of the brain is going to resort in animal tactics to respond - anger, frustration and illogical 'this is my opinion, you just have to accept it'.

It also caters to the 'I am better than _______________' - this is a basic animal need. Most of the crap going on in the world that does so much harm is the need to be better than. It is seen starkly in high school with Jocks, Goths, Cheerleaders and all of the other subgroups - each feel that they are better than the other and they have 'good reasons' to list. All are flawed, imperfect human beings who are not better than anyone else.

I tilted at this windmill of Gays are Normal with those vehemently opposed to the idea. The majority I had to battle with had a book to back up their claims (The Holy Bible). Even using that book against them lead to the anger/frustration shut down moment of 'This is my interpretation, just deal with it' which is akin to 'this is my opinion - like or or not'.

What ultimately won what few battles I did win was not my words of reason. It was my actions and behaviors and how I lead my own life as an example to others.

For instance my only having been with 8 men willingly (6 attempts at relationships, 2 one night stands) is in contrast to what most people believe about homosexuals --> a new sex partner every single night.

I also don't force 'gay' down anyone's throat. I'm 'straight acting' and don't lisp, snap my fingers and use 'fabulous' in every other sentence. So I do not come off as a gay man forcing people to accept homosexuality.

These little things did far much more to change the course of opinion than my presenting a ton of scientific data.

Gays are following stereotypes which are viewed negatively. Sadly a lot of the media focuses on the negative - rampant spread of STDS, promiscuity, and its nearly always and over the top nelly queen that represents us gays than a 'straight acting' guy in movies and TV shows. Granted this last is now changing and more and more of the gay characters are 'straight acting'. But I fear the damage was already done.

It is those stereotypes of gays that people fear more than what gays do in their own bedrooms. Its the fear of other, which most likely is what caused the extinction of Neanderthal with only 1.5-2% of neanderthal DNA surviving to the 21st century.

This minor DNA in human genes points out that not everyone is prone to hate out and out, in fact some are actually able to love the different, embrace it, have sex with it.....

[Cuddly]

Interesting idea that "hate" could be caused by genetics. I've always assumed opinions and ideas were the result of grooming/upbringing.
What if we do have a gene that says to hate what is different, but also have a gene that says to stray from the path of our parents? Both make sense, if you think about survival and development of the species, but they would also contradict each other.

My dad is a bit of a racist and my mum is very open and accepting. I consider myself very open and accepting, could the racist "gene" be recessive, if such a thing exists?

Just some thinking, no facts, other than my observations concerning mum and dad, from my side.

[ChadCoxRox]

Interesting idea that "hate" could be caused by genetics. I've always assumed ... Just some thinking, no facts, other than my observations concerning mum and dad, from my side.

Hit that nail buddy! Hit that nail! There is a wealth of research found in the stacks of any decent university about this matter. It seems there has been a propensity for the evidence regarding genetic programming to result in excuses for continued negative interests and so scientists (most social like myself) have sought to bring clarity to the data just so we can use it to help us better address barriers instead of just make excuses for and endure them.

If I know I inherited a profile for more aggression than passivity and combine that with my developmental environment I can come up with a slew of explanations and insight. I can even determine "why I am this way" or "why I do that." In the end, all the insight in the world brings little to bear on my situation aside from my own capacity to choose in the here and now. So the PROCESS of HOW I do becomes the most important factor in determining my own outcomes day in and day out. I choose. It's the most salient characteristic setting myself apart from all other species. Not wholly, not perfectly, but with confident assurance through time tested observation.

I hated by nature and nurture.

Now I may have a natural capacity for hate, but I've nurtured my choice to minimize it and best of all channel it for good (not pretty). I guess it expresses itself most in intestinal fortitude. I see that in much of Bowyn's posts. And given that tangent, I'd go further to suggest that a failure to understand or give a rat's ass about all of the above might easily explain the recent exodus from GS (not meaning to stir that pot, but just a timely reference).

[matty7]

I had a similar instance with a new starter at work saying it was unnatural - but I have found through experience that most people change their mind as they now me as a person and like me before they new I was gay - I don't pay attention to this sort of comment .. its sort of the macho response anyway ,, plus if it got personal I have faith in my capabilities to deal with people

[SoverignQuantum]

People seam to think we(People) aren't a part of nature but we are, our thoughts and feelings and the way we are with one another are indeed part of nature. So it is natural, especially if something scientific is found out.

[TonyAndonuts]

So I'm having a so far civil debate with someone and I'm trying to say that the way homosexuals feel is natural to them. But he says it's impossible to define natural. I'm not exactly sure how to respond. This is what he said.

"So you want to say that homosexuality is natural, but how are we defining natural? That's the underlying question. Who determines what is natural? If "natural" is what "feels right," then anything can be considered natural if feelings dictate reality. Unfortunately, that's not the case. You're trying to say that something is natural that many people disagree with for various reasons, be it religious reasons or not. In the end, you're still trying to say "My opinion of natural is right and yours is wrong," without an actual definition of "natural" to glean from. Therefore, people will continue to disagree with you."