How to discipline kids

[Virge]

My parents were tricky as hell.

Example.

It was taught to me from the time I could talk that if I did something I knew was wrong and they discovered it or heard it from others before they heard it from me I'd be in trouble. If they heard it from me first then we'd sit down and talk about it and find a way to fix whatever I'd done wrong -- without any punishment. That led me to always hurry anytime I did something wrong to squeal on myself --- which was exactly what they wanted me to do. I learned I could go to my parents and tell them ANYTHING without them getting mad and punishing me.

As a kid when I did something really bad and went to them to tattle on myself they'd tell me in a real nice way they needed to talk it over and that I needed to go to my room and think it over too before we talked about it. They'd come get me out of my room 30 minutes or an hour later to talk about it.

Do ya see the trick in that?????? Well I didn't until I was 13 and a friend explained it to me after something happened.

At thirteen I got drunk with cousins while spending the weekend with them. I came home and told my parents and was told they needed to think about it and so did I... so I went to my room... Hours later Dad came to tell me it was time to eat. I asked if they'd thought long enough about me telling them I'd gotten drunk and he said no --- they probably needed a day or two to think it over... and so did I.

So...... after three days of that from friend at school wanted me to come over. I explained I couldn't because I had to go home and think about having gotten drunk the weekend before and that my parents were still thinking about it too before we talked it over.

After he explained "restriction" to me I felt like a total idiot. For 13 years I'd been tricked into thinking restriction was just time to think things over. That afternoon I went to my parents mad as heck for tricking me for so many years. Both of them were barely trying not to laugh at me about it.

By that age I'd been so honest with my parents that anytime I needed to talk to anyone about nearly anything they were the first people I'd go to. I never got away from that even as I went into my "wild phase" once I had a drivers license. The only thing that changed was when I did something bad they'd just ask me "don't you think you need to spend a few days thinking about that before we talk more about it?"

When I get some rug rats I'm going to do them the same way! hahhahaha!

[Rareboy]

I don't believe in fucking with a kid's head by denial of affection or public humiliation. The consequences are far more horrible than just getting a spanking as far as I'm concerned (and I don't believe in corporal punishment at all!)

I do believe in the strategy that the OP or Virge's parents used.

Setting boundaries and teaching kids responsibility for their actions is a process that involves adults helping children to understand the negative implications of wrong action. Punishment for anything where a kid may not have any real understanding of why their behaviour or action was unacceptable is a waste of time. 'Because I said so' is the refuge of the intellectually weak adult. And punishment for wilfulness needs to be incredibly well thought out if you don't simply want to crush the soul of a child or set up an epic ongoing battle of the wills.

My favourite is to have the (over 10 year old) miscreant write out an essay on what they think the bad consequences of action could be versus why they would defend what they did. And then to have a discussion over the case they've made. And then to move on. For the younger kids, a time out with a gentle talk after they've settled down usually works.

The key though is to let a child know that there are boundaries and that if they cross them, there are consequences and to stick to the consequences. I am appalled by watching so many adults have explosive confrontations with kids and promise dire punishments and then do nothing. It is no wonder that so many kids have so many problems with self discipline.

[ShiftyNJ]

Don't have kids, probably never will, but we have 8 nieces/nephews ranging in age from college to six weeks old!

What I've observed is that it used to be more "okay" for any adult to step in and correct a young person's behavior. Nowadays kids have DYFS (or whatever your local equivalent is) on speed-dial and parents and other authorities are afraid to open their mouths. Also as CuriousPhoenix said, parents think their kids are special snowflakes who can do no wrong. The kids I taught as a youth group leader for a few years all seemed to call the shots with their parents... at age 13-16 they had way more autonomy than I did at that age... and these are the "good kids" whose parents can get them to go to church!

We almost never got hit but lived in fear of the unknown. My dad had a look that could freeze you like Lot's wife! I got in very little trouble as a kid, moved out at 17 for school and seem to have made something of myself in that I am able to provide for myself and partner, and still have a great relationship with family. So I guess whatever they did worked!

[Virge]

@ Rareboy...
My parents explained their parenting strategy to me and it makes perfect sense.

Punishing, whipping and restricting kids for bad things gives an incentive for kids to lie to parents to avoid getting in trouble. It's hardwired into us to lie to escape discomfort and punishment. Hardwired? YES! Have you read about Koko the gorilla lying to get out of trouble???? As soon as kids learn to talk they know how to blame things on others to stay out of trouble. No one teaches them that.

My parents gave me powerful posiitve incentives to trust them and never lie. I did lie to them a couple of times to cover up stupid things I would've been embarrassed to tell them about. Guess what? When they found out I wasn't punished for lying but hugged and assured I didn't need to hide anything from them.

[ShiftyNJ]

@ Rareboy...
My parents explained their parenting strategy to me and it makes perfect sense.

Punishing, whipping and restricting kids for bad things gives an incentive for kids to lie to parents to avoid getting in trouble. It's hardwired into us to lie to escape discomfort and punishment. Hardwired? YES! Have you read about Koko the gorilla lying to get out of trouble???? As soon as kids learn to talk they know how to blame things on others to stay out of trouble. No one teaches them that.

My parents gave me powerful posiitve incentives to trust them and never lie. I did lie to them a couple of times to cover up stupid things I would've been embarrassed to tell them about. Guess what? When they found out I wasn't punished for lying but hugged and assured I didn't need to hide anything from them.

That makes perfect sense to me... I watched it happen IN REVERSE recently. My two nephews (age 8 and 2.5) were each trying to cover the other's butt by taking the heat for a mess they inadvertently made while chasing each other. In truth it was an accident and not worth punishing either of them for... they helped clean up to the degree that they could and that was that.

Your parents' "time out" method has the added advantage of giving both parent AND child the chance to cool down and face the situation more calmly and with more perspective when the time to discuss it comes.

[CuriousPhoenix]

I see so many kids in public that misbehave. They run around their parents touching things, yelling, screaming, torturing their siblings, and disturbing everyone around them. All the while their parents are either ignoring them or trying to get them to behave. I feel so bad for their parents and the embarrassment they are in over their child's behavior. So many parents can't control their kids. It's because they don't punish them properly.

My siblings and I were all born within a 5 year period, so we could be very hard to handle but we never misbehaved like kids nowadays. We knew that if we did misbehave, no matter what my mother or father were doing, they would stop and we all would leave and be punished when we got home. At the young ages we were, we loved going out and seeing new things, so we rather behave and see the new things than go home and be punished. I wish I could remember exactly how my parents set this up.

[LJay]

Seems that the basic idea here is that to discipline kids you must engage them. The kids taht I have worked with have always wanted to be a part of things and to be treated with respect. That does not mean that they like being rudderless boats on the pond. A reasonable amount of structure allows them to explore saafely and that security can make them to be more free and less afraid.

Watching mothers in a laundromat once time, I came to the conclusion that there are two kinds. One just yells at her misbehaving kids and the other calls them to her and talks to them or distracts them with something more constructive, or, if necessary, puts the brakes full on. In any case, the second kid is getting more constructive attention.

[ShiftyNJ]

Seems that the basic idea here is that to discipline kids you must engage them. The kids taht I have worked with have always wanted to be a part of things and to be treated with respect. That does not mean that they like being rudderless boats on the pond. A reasonable amount of structure allows them to explore saafely and that security can make them to be more free and less afraid.

Watching mothers in a laundromat once time, I came to the conclusion that there are two kinds. One just yells at her misbehaving kids and the other calls them to her and talks to them or distracts them with something more constructive, or, if necessary, puts the brakes full on. In any case, the second kid is getting more constructive attention.

A lot of what kids do (hell a lot of what ADULTS do) is to be noticed. They would usually prefer positive attention, but if negative is what they can get, they'll take it. Too many parents treat their kids as an annoying distraction and try to keep them placated with snacks, toys, the ubiquitous SCREENS that are everywhere... when I was 5 we drove from NYC to our family's farms in northern Alberta, and then back by way of California... five weeks in the car with a bagful of toys, AM radio and no air conditioning. I remember a lot more that trip than I would if I spent the whole time watching Spongebob Squarepants or what have you.

I often wonder what they thought being a parent was going to be like. I also know that I don't have the patience for it myself, which is why I chose not to be one.

[spilovn]

you have to ask are you discipline them or are they just behaving for you mr nice guy.