Homonormativity... is it a thing?

[MikeW]

The "we" I guess is anybody trying to achieve social justice. I don't think most people's motives are cynical or exploitative... but (as you said) someone is pulling the strings and probably affecting our understanding of the situation.

The way the narrative around Matthew Shepard's death was "managed" is a good example.

Some of my mottos:

Who ever controls your perception of reality controls you.

We base our decisions on what we believe to be true-- whether it is true or not.

The best way to thwart a revolution is to lead it.

[Buzzer]

So in the "SJW" world there are always new terms and definitions... here is one that I have not heard before "homonormativity" which - it states - is trying to define something that has been around for a long time.

The idea is that -- within queer culture -- there is a pecking (heh) order and that relatively wealthy gay cisgender white men are at the top; the most visible, and given the loudest voice. It states that the focus on gay marriage as the highest priority (at the expense of equal employment or housing laws) reinforces that structure as this is a higher priority for these people than, say, for trangender women of color.

It further posits that our society (and the corporations that drive it) rewards those same-gender couples who conform (or attempt to conform) with the heteronormative ideals of monogamy, child-bearing (or at least rearing) and other efforts to assimilate to the wider culture. You can read the article here.

What do you think? Do you subscribe to the "we're just like you" mentality, preferring to not have your sexuality be "an issue", or do you think we should be doing more to celebrate what makes us unique as a population? Do you think what the authors describe is real, and--if so-- do you think it is the cis "masc" gay white man's job to fix it?

This sounds like a complete mess and I don't doubt one bit you are accurately representing the mess that happens out there in heated cyberspace discussions and in the discussion sections of Queer grad studies programs.

I've been saying it a lot more simply for years. Being gay white men didn't stop a lot of gay people from being white men. The mythical gay solidarity tends to evaporate when you start bringing up race issues among gay men. The majority simply don't want to hear it, and thus think about it or address it. Another group makes it pretty clear they are fine with inequalities which benefit them and only have a problem with the ones that target them. I'll out myself and say I think the notion of any kind of uniform or global or universal gay community, movement or anything else is a largely first world gay white male myth. You talk to almost any other kind of gay man around the planet and you're not only going to hear about gay issues, you're going to hear about cultural issues, racial issues, ethnic issues alongside it. And in general men who are white and gay would prefer to sideline these things and say it's separate and try to hush the topic away.

Ask yourself this, if gay marriage was fully accepted, legally and socially tomorrow, who would have total social equality in our society tomorrow? Do you really think it would be all gay men?

I don't think gay people of color have the luxury of regarding the issues as separate. You don't have alternating gay days and black days or gay days and Asian days. It's one experience.

[East]

This sounds like a complete mess and I don't doubt one bit you are accurately representing the mess that happens out there in heated cyberspace discussions and in the discussion sections of Queer grad studies programs.

I've been saying it a lot more simply for years. Being gay white men didn't stop a lot of gay people from being white men. The mythical gay solidarity tends to evaporate when you start bringing up race issues among gay men. The majority simply don't want to hear it, and thus think about it or address it. Another group makes it pretty clear they are fine with inequalities which benefit them and only have a problem with the ones that target them. I'll out myself and say I think the notion of any kind of uniform or global or universal gay community, movement or anything else is a largely first world gay white male myth. You talk to almost any other kind of gay man around the planet and you're not only going to hear about gay issues, you're going to hear about cultural issues, racial issues, ethnic issues alongside it. And in general men who are white and gay would prefer to sideline these things and say it's separate and try to hush the topic away.

Ask yourself this, if gay marriage was fully accepted, legally and socially tomorrow, who would have total social equality in our society tomorrow? Do you really think it would be all gay men?

I don't think gay people of color have the luxury of regarding the issues as separate. You don't have alternating gay days and black days or gay days and Asian days. It's one experience.

I agree for the most part but I do want to point out one thing I disagree with. Homonormative Men of color have every reason to expect the same visibility and acceptance as their white counterparts IF they get their pod person card stamped and validated. Pod people of color are no different than white pod people....not unlike what Condoleeza Rice is to the Republican Party. If you project the right image... you can play

With that exception noted...I agree with the rest of your points.

[Jerry]

Well, I like it! I´m just too old for this political (shit) unfortunately! So, I couldn't care less if some trans gender queer feels left alone. I´m an ordinary and average middle aged cis gay man. By the way, I just bumped into this cis term just only few months ago and I really like it, even if I´m not that all american masculine hero-type, but I´m all natural me and I like it! I´ve heard some trans people used it as a negative way, so that really isn´t helping to keep LGBT-movement united. But, perhaps that´s the american way, I´m not into politics...I just enjoy and be glad and proud of all those successful gay men and gay couples in the media. Thank you all