Jealousy in friendships / partnerships

[Aquarius]

How do you look on jealousy in friendships or partnerships? Any experience in that?
Not meaning being jealous because he's flirting with someone else, but more about finances, success, popularity, other privileges.

In a world where we naturally meet a lot of different people, it's quite normal to meet people who are a lot more or a lot less "privileged" than oneself. Everyone might be the one who's envied at some point, even if you are really poor, there might be something about you that causes jealousy from others.

I think jealousy is a natural, human thing, and whenever there are financial or other differences, it's nearly unavoidable. But it's damn annoying for both sides.

I just had the idea for this thread cos I just talked to a friend who's travelling around the world a lot. I would love to travel, but I won't be able to travel as much within the next 30 years as he does within a year, unless some drastic change in my life happens. So yeah, I'm jealous.

I also know that noone's life is perfect, and even if you are jealous on someone, there might be something about him that you wouldn't want to swap with.

But how is that affecting friendships and partnerships for you? Can you really be friends with, or in a partnership with, someone who's much more or much less privileged? Does jealousy make you feel inferior? (it does for me) - and if your friend/partner is jealous on you, how do you feel about that?

[East]

I have enough other shortcomings to make up for it....but jealousy isn't even on my menu...never has been....

The whole concept of jealousy is kinda foreign to me.

I thought about it before..the first time many years ago when someone else pointed it out to me....and I think it is because I don't compare myself to anyone. ...and I think it is a waste of time to even go there since you are you..and not them....so what is the point?

The other thing...I am happy for someone if they are happy..and I kinda think a lot of people (not all) with a lot of money are soulless....or I have no respect for their ethics... and jealousy is the farthest thing from my mind....

I have never wanted to be wealthy either...I think I would shun it if it became available. It creeps me out to know someone is filthy rich and..for instance... pays 1000+ for a freaking bottle of wine when other people are starving...I can't reconcile that at all....and jealousy is the last thing I would feel...

I have had people jealous of me before that I know of...mostly at work...and I have had people tell me that someone is jealous of this or that but I not sure it is true as it is kinda hard for me to see and/or understand anyway. The times I know of though..my reaction is to try to diffuse it but if I can't...I start to avoid them and get them out of my sphere because it can be sickening to observe...

[Aquarius]

Oh, I constantly compare myself to others. It's nothing I actively choose to do. It just goes automatically and I can't stop it. Like breathing..

Anyway, what would interest me: how - also practically spoken - couples with financial differences can work. Obviously I'm not talking about that 1000+ bottle of wine category of "rich" (rich is relative), but more common stuff. Holidays, going out, if one is more wealthy than the other. I wouldn't want a richer guy to pay what I can't afford, neither would I do that if my boyfriend was poorer. But that must mean the more wealthier person has to resist doing what he usually would do? That doesn't seem healthy to me.

That's why I put the thread not about jealousy per se, but jealousy in friendships / partnerships.

[MikeW]

...Can you really be friends with, or in a partnership with, someone who's much more or much less privileged? Does jealousy make you feel inferior? (it does for me) - and if your friend/partner is jealous on you, how do you feel about that?

First of all, lets clarify our terms. You're making a common mistake a lot of people make, confusing "jealousy" and "envy". Envy and jealousy are not interchangeable words. They mean different things:

Envy is when you want what someone else has, but jealousy is when you're afraid someone's trying to take what you already have. Envy requires two parties, you and the person you are envious of. You covet (desire or want for yourself) their looks, their job, their wealth, their power, their personality, their relationship. Jealousy requires three parties: You, a person you have a relationship with (partner, BF, husband), and a third person you perceive as a potential threat to your relationship. You can feel envy about something you don't have but want, but you feel jealousy over someone you already have in your life but are afraid of losing. So, when you use "envy" above, you're using it correctly. But envy isn't Jealousy.

So your question is: How do you deal with envy and does envy make you feel inferior?

To me the answer is obvious: If you are happy with yourself, accepting of yourself as you are, you will not feel envy... or very rarely and not to any great extent. Moreover, I'm not sure feeling "envious" is necessarily a bad thing... it depends on what you DO with that feeling.

For example, I'm an old man. I'll be 68 next month. I just stated working out a few years ago. I've made big progress in that time. I've learned a lot. Lost a lot of fat. Gained some muscle and have an overall better sense of self worth and physical health.

That said, I *envy* the young men who work out at my gym. I see that they can do things that I can't do. They have a range of flexibility and motion, suppleness, that allows them to move and work their muscles in a way that I simply can not. I both admire and envy that.

BUT... I don't let this stop me from working out. I watch what they do. I use my feelings of envy and admiration as inspiration. I use them to motivate me to flex and stretch and do things the best I can... and to work through certain limitations. For sure, my body will never be as supple and flexible as someone in their 20s BUT that doesn't mean I can't increase my range of motion and flexibility. I can. And have. And will continue to do so.

So, to me, "envy" isn't the problem. The problem is my sense of self-worth. If I have low self-esteem, a poor sense of self-worth, then, yeah, whenever I see someone who has something I want... then rather than feeling motivated or inspired, I feel defeated, deflated, put down or let down, stopped. From my "less than" vantage, my DIS-advantage, I simply WISH I were them or WISH I had what they have. I stay STUCK in my own sense of limitation.

For sure if I feel this way about myself and am trying to build a relationship with someone else, comparing myself to them so they are on some pedestal and I am in some hole.... that is NOT going to work. (Or, rather, the only way it could work is AS A DYSFUNCTIONAL RELATIONSHIP. That is, one where my being one-down helps the other to feel one-up. A mutually destructive relationship rather than a mutually beneficial relationship.)

Envy is a problem when, like you're asking, it makes me feel "inferior" in some way and THAT sense of inferiority STOPS me. To me, that *stoppage* is the problem, not the envy. It isn't that I have to HAVE everything that someone else has -- that is impossible, right? I'd have to BE that person to have everything he has. I'm NOT that person, I'm me.

SO... what I need first of all is "self-acceptance."

Self acceptance is a concept that a lot of people misunderstand. Self-acceptance does not mean that I give up or stop changing and growing. What it means is that I try to look at myself objectively, see the truth of myself for myself. This doesn't have anything to do with anyone else, how anyone else is or what anyone else has. It has to do with my appreciation of myself, who I am, what I am. When I accept myself it does not mean that I stop wanting more for myself than I have. It means that I accept that I am such as I am... and understand that some things about myself CAN CHANGE *if I want to change them*... where other things simply can NOT change, and that's perfectly alright. For example, I *CAN* become more flexible than I am, with the right knowledge, practice, exercise, perseverance. BUT I can *NOT* be 22 years old again. Not in this body. I have to accept there are real limitations. But at the same time, that doesn't mean I can't be MORE than I currently am.

Bottom line, if you have a low sense of self-worth and you're feeling envious of other people, AND you're letting this envy STOP you from becoming all that YOU can be, then THAT... the sense of low self-esteem... is the real issue, not the envy. The very first thing you need to do is try and accept yourself. Accept that you are who you are. You have what you have. And THEN see if your "envy," your "wish for more" can motivate you to move beyond your current limitations. Your current limitations may NOT be your absolute limits... in fact they almost never are. To find your absolute limits, you have to push yourself way beyond what you believe are your current limits. And to do that, you have to WANT to badly enough. But if you don't want to... if you're fine with the way you are... truly... then there's nothing to envy.

[TwisttheLeaf]

Thank you [MENTION=20947]MikeW[/MENTION] for pointing out the distinction between Jealousy and Envy. I spent a good part of my time reading the OP feeling confused due to the use of the word jealousy until I finally realized that the OP -meant- envy.

The only thing I have ever felt envy for is people's bottom line (ie: their finances). This isn't due to low self esteem so much as the fact that I have spent my life since the age of 16 struggling to stay afloat concerning my own bottom line.

Has it interfered with relationships and friendships? No. I guess it could if I allowed others to suck me into trying to live in their reality, or live their way of life. But those friendships I've had with people far wealthier than myself? I required them to fit into my reality, not the other way around.

[Aquarius]

I am sorry, in my language, we have one word for both, jealousy and envy... so that's the background of my word choice.

[Insertnamehere]

I am certainly envious of how my dating (non-dating anyway) scenario looks whe compared to others.

For reasons A,B and C, it is like that, ok. Doesn't make it easier when your only gay acquaintance has 2 BFs per year.

Sigh, even those who complain about "never finding someone" eventually do and rather not as hard as they claimed to have it, which makes it all, in retrospective, all the more irritating.

So, yes, I'm an envious little fucker.

Only on counted occasions have I said this to a few of them, and they seemed to understand my thinking, at least.

Mind you, most of what gives me this envy are personal things...which means, and this makes it all worse...it's my fault not theirs. This is my failure at life. Yes I am mostly to blame if I'm 28 and never as much as kissed another guy. Oh well.

So, to answer your question, yes and no they didn't find it a cause to end the aquaintance.

[MikeW]

...Yes I am mostly to blame if I'm 28 and never as much as kissed another guy. Oh well. ...

At least you admit it and accept it as being your responsibility.

Do you want to say more (in this or some other thread) about WHY or how come?

[Insertnamehere]

At least you admit it and accept it as being your responsibility.

Do you want to say more (in this or some other thread) about WHY or how come?

I'm sure it's not correct to draw attention from Felix's issues to mine here. Perhaps another "venue" maybe more proper

[trywait]

you cant have everything all at the same time. am I jealous or envious of other people? not so much. yea, I wish I had something similar but I look back and still quite fortunate for everything that I have as well. might not be all that I want, but everything I need, pretty much have it