red-figure homoerotic images

[LONDONER]

Those interested in homoerotic art might be interested in this that is in the British Museum:

http://www.britishmuseumshoponline.org/s...GwodA-UKiw

[LJay]

What if I just want to drink honeyed wine out of a silver cup?

[LJay]

Actually there were protocols about homosexual relationships but it has been a long while since I have read much on the subject. I suppose you could google homosexuality in the ancient world or some such. Whether it was Greek or Roman I can't recall but I do remember reading about the routine for an older maninitiating a younger one. there was a dish of olive oil involved. Extra virgin olive oil? One hopes.

[LONDONER]

What if I just want to drink honeyed wine out of a silver cup?

There's nothing to stop you drinking wine out of a silver cup but if you wanted to drink wine out of this silver cup then presumably you would be in a situation and/or with company of a like minded person or persons and then the atmosphere would be different.

[princealbertofb]

Actually there were protocols about homosexual relationships but it has been a long while since I have read much on the subject. I suppose you could google homosexuality in the ancient world or some such. Whether it was Greek or Roman I can't recall but I do remember reading about the routine for an older maninitiating a younger one. there was a dish of olive oil involved. Extra virgin olive oil? One hopes.

Do you think there was any other kind available at the time, [MENTION=20933]LJay[/MENTION]?

[LJay]

Actually, Al, I am pretty sure that there were grades of oil in those days. Lesser quality oil would have been used for such things as lamps, while the good stuff went to those who cold afford it, I'll bet. I wonder if Apicius addresses this, "At the very least, there were different kinds of olive oil because there were different varieties of olive trees. A byproduct of oil making, amurca, had a number of uses. Oil was used not only for lamps but also in pharmaceutical ointments, so there may have been different viscosities. I know I am doing some guesswork here but the Greeks and Romans, being the merchants that they were, would probably not have missed the chance to make a distinction between this oil and that and thus take the opportunity to make more money.

[meridannight]

Actually there were protocols about homosexual relationships but it has been a long while since I have read much on the subject. I suppose you could google homosexuality in the ancient world or some such. Whether it was Greek or Roman I can't recall but I do remember reading about the routine for an older maninitiating a younger one. there was a dish of olive oil involved. Extra virgin olive oil? One hopes.

That depended a lot on where in Greece you were, actually. Sparta and Crete were different than Athens, which was different than Boeotia, for example.

From my understanding of this subject, men still did what they wanted to do. They did not have to adhere to any protocols, actually. Just, some forms of expression were deemed nobler than others by the public opinion, and, as said, that varied according to region (and according to individual within that region, I would say).

Even the scholars still haven't figured out this subject, despite the apparent consensus on some of the particulars. Some of that has come by through opinion and subjective interpretations rather than what we can call 'facts'. In my opinion, we can't claim anything with reasonable certainty here (outside the observation that homosexuality existed).

And nor do I think we should try to form theories on what they did or thought about it. Because it is impossible for us to know that, and everything we have to say on the subject comes through one bias or another, which unnecessarily and fatally muddles up the whole topic. Unless we unearth some text titled ''history of homosexuality and relationships between men'' written a couple of centuries BCE, we will never know.

I personally don't think they were that different from us. Men are men, whether they lived in 500 BCE or 2016 CE.

(P.S. Rome is a bit different story, with a clearer view than Greece).

[LJay]

[MENTION=21405]meridannight[/MENTION], you are right. I was painting with a broad brush, though just as today some things worked and some did not in the eyes of society. Yes, men will be men.