circumcised vs uncircumcised

[fjp999]

From a medical point of view I will point out that:

The World Health Organization (WHO; 2007), the Joint United Nations Programme on HIV/AIDS (UNAIDS; 2007), and the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC; 2008) state that evidence indicates male circumcision significantly reduces the risk of HIV acquisition by men during penile-vaginal sex, but also state that circumcision only provides partial protection and should not replace other interventions to prevent transmission of HIV.

[COLOR="Purple"]This was brought to light by a number of Africans including one physician.

Here is some really fun/scary info (I have tried to make it hard to read so you may have to highlight to see [/COLOR]

Adult circumcisions are often performed without clamps and require 4 to 6 weeks of abstinence from masturbation or intercourse after the operation to allow the wound to heal. In some African countries, male circumcision is often performed by non-medical personnel under unsterile conditions. After hospital circumcision, the foreskin may be used in biomedical research, consumer skin-care products, skin grafts, or β-interferon-based drugs. In parts of Africa, the foreskin may be dipped in brandy and eaten by the patient, eaten by the circumciser, or fed to animals. According to Jewish law, after a Brit milah, the foreskin should be buried.

My Japanese partner was always thinking of getting his cut. He said it was a pain keeping it clean and it hurt sometimes glad he never did

[fudger]

Interesting that 80% prefer uncut (at time of writing this).
I am uncut and my partner is cut (medical need at 14).
The doctors really made a mess of his foreskin, loads of scar tissue and he would do anything to get it back.
If someone cannot keep their helmet clean then they must have a problem, maybe its too tight to pull back and clean properly in which case they need to go see a Dr before it gets infected.

[marshlander]

From a medical point of view I will point out that:

Someone usually raises the HIV/AIDS/Africa research. The figures may not actually be as significant as we are led to believe. Whilst it is claimed there is the (significant) reduction in the risk of infection by 60% against men who remained intact, the absolute reduction of infection was found to be the much less significant 1.5% during the two years of the study. Complications associated with these circumcisions ran at 3%. Doesn't that suggest that the risk of post-operative complications was approximately twice that of a reduction in the risk of contracting HIV?

It would appear that all is not as has been presented and widely publicised:

[COLOR="Indigo"]The African HIV studies fall short of the gold-standard of proof of medical effectiveness. The lack of blinding in the studies makes them prone to "observer bias". The researchers were known to be biassed since they had previously published work advocating male circumcision for the prevention of HIV in Africa.

The studies recruited men who "wanted to be circumcised" because the participants believed that circumcision would protect them from HIV. Those who were circumcised in the studies had less sex than those who were not since they alone were told to abstain from sex for six weeks.

The number of study participants who were "lost to follow-up" from the studies far outweighed the number of participants who acquired the virus. This casts serious doubt on the validity of the research findings.[23]

The studies were terminated early. Research has shown that studies terminated early consistently overestimate the benefits of treatment.[24][25] In two well-documented cases a data-monitoring committee recommended that the study be terminated early because there was no possibility of the treatment being shown to be ineffective but the study nevertheless went on to its end.[26][27] The conclusion was that the treatment was not effective. It has been suggested that exciting finding in studies terminated early merely "reflect the prevailing bias" of the research community.

The studies have been supported by a massive publicity machine to drive home the conclusion. Publication of the studies was accompanied by pictures on the TV news of African boys being rushed into gleaming sterile operating theatres of a type that are thin on the ground in Africa. The reality is that African boys will be circumcised in the bush with a dirty knife that has just circumcised an HIV positive boy. As such, to promote circumcision in Africa is recklessly irresponsible.

The researchers have emphasised exciting reductions in relative risk while the findings in terms of absolute risk are less appealing. Even where the prevalence of HIV is very high, the risks of circumcision outweighed the benefits. In developed nations the risk to benefit ratio will be much higher.

That said, the researchers are to be complemented for being the first to use a Randomised Controlled Trial to prove that circumcision is actually effective in preventing a disease. Given this ground breaking finding, why will they not share their data with other researchers outside their closed group?[/COLOR]

The rest of the article may be read here

Frank also raised some of the issues connected with the circumcision industry. Here's a link to another page on the same site Where Do All the Foreskins Go?

Whatever religious, social or "preventative" health pressures may be applied to justify circumcision I believe the ethical reasons for allowing all men a free and informed choice once they reach sexual maturity far outweigh them. Who in their right mind would suggest that all babies have an appendectomy, because they might just get appendicitis when they grow up? Infant circumcision is child abuse of the very worst kind (I use this emotive language because where carried out it is usually done in cold blood and without any consideration being given to the child) and can never be justified unless there are medical reasons (and the permanent surgical option is sometimes applied too readily as well). Infant circumcision has no place in a civilised society and the sooner it is outlawed the better.

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[SIZE="1"][COLOR="Indigo"]23 Green LW et al. Male circumcision is not the HIV 'vaccine' we have been waiting for! Future HIV Ther. (2008) 2(3), 193–199.

24 Montori VM, Devereaux PJ, Adhikari NKJ, et al. Randomized trials stopped early for benefit: a systematic review. JAMA. 2005;294:2203-2209.

25 Ioannidis JP. Contradicted and initially stronger effects in highly cited clinical research. JAMA. 2005;294:218-228.

26 Wheatley K, Clayton D. Be skeptical about unexpected large apparent treatment effects: the case of an MRC AML12 randomization. Control Clin Trials. 2003;24:66-70.

27 Slutsky AS, Lavery JV. Data safety and monitoring boards. N Engl J Med. 2004;350:1143-1147.[/COLOR][/SIZE]

[princealbertofb]

My brother who had to have a circumcision as an adult is the one brother who died of Aids... so that claim still remains to be proven. the rest of us were uncut... Strange as he's also the one who nearly had it chopped off at birth, being born in the States where these operations are carried out routinely. Our mother saved his foreskin in the nick of time.

[Brazenhead]

I have no real preference, as long as it is in full working order I am happy enough.

[jayce]

Well I'm a Jew so I'm circumcised... I don't really care about other people. As long as it works and isn't full of diseases then awesome.

[andy]

Well I'm a Jew so I'm circumcised... I don't really care about other people. As long as it works and isn't full of diseases then awesome.

Wow Korean/Japanese and Jewish! How did you manage that?

Yeah, I think it's more about the person... cut/uncut doesn't really matter!

[jayce]

[SIZE="1"]I'm a Jew because of a whole load of Jew/Asian marriages that happened a very very very long time ago.

Technically I'm only part Jewish. But it's easier to just say I'm Jewish than to explain how exactly it all works out haha.[/SIZE]

[andy]

I'm a Jew because of a whole load of Jew/Asian marriages that happened a very very very long time ago.

Technically I'm only part Jewish. But it's easier to just say I'm Jewish than to explain how exactly it all works out haha.

Kewlies sorry for being nosey! :biggrin: Did you hear that Jamie Oliver says he is 6th generation African - Sudanese? (aparently that's why they've got a lot of curly hair in his family! :tongue

[jayce]

[SIZE="1"]Hahah I didn't know that.
[/SIZE]