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Why America makes me angry sometimes
#51
I recall the Mormons were driven west due in part because their policies on slavery and race made those in the South uncomfortable due to the fact that they were too progressive and then once they reached Utah they did a prompt 180. My knowledge of the church's history is pretty spotty though admittedly but they've been pretty wishy washy for a while now same as most religions I spose.
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#52
fredv3b Wrote:Me thought that the Mormon church tended to stand back from politics for most of the first half of the twentieth century ...
If that were the case I suspect it may have been because the publicity machine didn't operate the same as nowadays. Mormons have always been encouraged to get involved in their communities and accept public office should opportunity come their way, although I cannot obviously speak from first hand knowledge of the first half of the twentieth century!

During the years when I did attend church I can remember a number of occasions when messages were read out from the "General Authorities" of the church in meetings urging us to get involved in active campaigning for promoting the church line on issues such as the Equal Rights Amendment and abortion (both anti, by the way). No doubt I'd have heard similar messages when glbt equality was being debated in Parliament. Probably one of the best known LDS politicians was George W. Romney who became Governor of Michigan, while his cousin, Marion George Romney was first elected to public office in the 1930s and we all know about Mitt. Particularly in places where Mormons are plentiful they will obviously have a higher political profile. Here in the UK we hear less about them being involved in public affairs simply because being an active member of the church is very time-consuming. Building and maintaining Zion as a parallel society takes a bit of effort.
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#53
What happened to the FPPC's investigation into the LDS church over its involvement in the Califonia's Proposition 8 vote in 2007. How much did they really spend on their campaign and were they conspiring with other churches to defeat gay marriages.
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#54
I do wonder if a federal move towards equality wouldnt cause something of a catastrophe on the local level what with the kind of deranged polarized insanity we already get in American politics over the merest assumptions.
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#55
Rychard the Lionheart Wrote:What happened to the FPPC's investigation into the LDS church over its involvement in the Califonia's Proposition 8 vote in 2007. How much did they really spend on their campaign and were they conspiring with other churches to defeat gay marriages.
I don't know if the Fair Political Practices Commission has reported yet? They still seemed to be accepting new evidence back in the spring of this year.
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#56
Suppose the FPPC were to rule that the LDS church (or for that matter any other large group) had breached the rules. What meaningful action could the FPPC take? Given that they were prepared to spend such vast amounts of money on getting Prop. 8 passed I suspect they would regard a reasonable level of fine to be acceptable cost of doing political business.
Fred

Life is what happens while you are busy making other plans.
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#57
Whatever it was they could afford it. They could always sell off a few of the farms they own here in Norfolk!
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#58
This article came from the New York Times website, originally published: Tuesday, July 2, 1991

Income of Mormon Church Is Put at $4.7 Billion a Year


A Phoenix newspaper reported Sunday that the Mormon Church, which does not disclose its finances, collects at least $4.3 billion a year from its members and $400 million more from its many enterprises.

Nearly all that $4.7 billion is spent furthering religious goals, The Arizona Republic said, but it added that the church also invested several hundred million dollars a year in real estate and securities and in expanding its businesses and investments. The newspaper said the figures were conservative estimates based on an eight-month investigation.

Don LeFevre, a spokesman at the national headquarters of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints here, said of the newspaper's report, "The estimates of the church's income are just that, estimates by The Republic, and they were grossly overstated."

He said that reporters preparing the article sought confirmation of their data but that church officials "did not get into the money figures" and "did not verify them." Secrecy on Finances

Accurately assessing the church's finances from the outside is impossible, because in 1959 Mormon leaders stopped disclosing financial reports even to the church's members. The church has 7.7 million members worldwide, including more than one million in Utah.

"It is not required and the church chooses not to make these records public," Mr. LeFevre said. "Members certainly aren't clamoring for them."

Instead of a financial report, church officials assure members that their contributions are managed "prayerfully and with inspiration."

The diversified corporate organization built by the Mormon Church is apparently free of financial fraud or personal wealth-building among top officials, the newspaper said.

Compared with sales of publicly traded companies, the church's $4.7 billion would place it about 110th on the Fortune 500 list of top corporations.

The Republic article said the Seventh-day Adventist Church, which has a worldwide membership of 6.2 million, collected $4.1 billion in tithings in 1990.

The church's business subsidiaries generate an additional $4 billion a year in sales, which, if counted in the total, would make the Mormon Church an $8 billion-a-year corporation, comparable with the Union Carbide Corporation and Borden Inc., The Republic said.

The newspaper said it was unlikely that it had identified all the church's companies, business names or affiliated holdings because financial data were incomplete, partly outdated and sometimes contradictory.

But the newspaper said it was able to conclude that the Mormon Church controlled at least 100 companies or businesses; had become one the nation's largest private landowners, with holdings in all 50 states, and appointed spiritual leaders who could double as business leaders to oversee real estate, communications, tourism, insurance and education operations.

In a written statement, church officials said of the newspaper's report, "While portions of the series are accurate, there are many deficiencies."


Is the LDS a church or a major business empire?

Are there any poor mormons ?
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#59
It is easy to become cynical about many things to do with this organisation, but there are indeed many poor Mormons. However, they also have an impressive support system that is generally able to help out those who need it. My ex is still an active member of the church, as is my father, with whom I live when in the UK. When we went through some tough times financially they were able to offer support by making sure we had enough food even though I was not an active member. Almost all the "clergy" are volunteers. What always struck me as strange was that although many members come from what we might once have called "working class" backgrounds the church never really learned how to deal with those people on their own terms. I did encounter a lot of fish-out-of-water wannabe professionals though. Weird.
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#60
The grassroots of the UK church might be sound and working for the people it serves. But I feel that the parent organisation in Utah have a different agenda, looking at the developments in the area of its business interests, which is ever increasing. My concern is the growth and size of its media companies.

The LDS Church First Presidency asked Mark Willes, former publisher of the Los Angeles Times and former CEO of its parent company, Times Mirror Company. To take over leadership of Deseret Management, the for-profit company that oversees commercial businesses attached to the church, including the Deseret News and KSL Radio.Willes also announced the formation of the KSL Broadcast Division, which will be created from Bonneville International Corp. Bonneville had owned and operated KSL-TV and KSL NewsRadio, as well as 28 radio stations in eight U.S. markets. Willies said "We will also see growth in the number of properties and we will see a continued expansion of our audience and our reach," .

It has enough financial muslce to fight and support any campagian it chooses to launch against any opponent of the church and its ideology. This was clearly demonstrated in Califonia in 2007, and will be used on other issues in the future.

My fear is that the LDS church leaders will have the power to manipulate the public on issues without any controls, their defence would be that they are a religious organisation and protecting the morality ot the people.

So folks, now I'm having a rant.Blahblah
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