I am totally disgusted ,once again they preach what Jesus did not speak.
Have we somehow gone back in time?
What the hell , what happens to the women that are abused ?
Not to mention not being allowed to save your child from abuse.
What's next ; a reunion with the RCC ; take away our vote?
The whore of Babylon( Babylon the great) is sleeping in the devils bed.
Quote:To love and to submit, new vow for brides.
BRIDES will be promising to submit to their husbands under a new marriage vow the Anglican diocese of Sydney is expected to approve at its synod in October.
It requires the minister to ask of the bride: ''Will you honour and submit to him, as the church submits to Christ?'' and for her to pledge ''to love and submit'' to her husband.
The service is already being used in some Sydney parishes, under a diocese that opposes the full ordination of women and supports an exclusively male leadership doctrine.
The vows were written by the diocese's liturgical panel, which has the imprimatur of the Archbishop, Peter Jensen. The panel chairman, the Bishop of South Sydney, Robert Forsyth, said ''submit'' was a deeply biblical word.
''The Bible never said women must obey their husbands but Paul and Peter did say submit, which I think is a much more responsive, nuanced word.''
The bishop said no one would be forced to use the new version, and an alternative would remain available to couples who did not want the woman to obey (which has been optional since 1928) or submit.
Kevin Giles, a New Testament scholar in Melbourne, said the subordination of women was exclusively related to ''the fall'' in the Bible and in 2012 made for bad theology.
''Jesus not once mentions the subordination of woman and says much in contradiction to this. Paul's comments over the subordination of women fit into the patriarchal culture of the day and are not the biblical ideal. The truth is that happy marriages today are fully equal, and unhappy marriages are ones where one or the other party is controlling.''
Muriel Porter, a Melbourne academic and laywoman who writes on Anglican Church issues, said submit was a more derogatory word than obey and had connotations of slavery. ''Frankly I'm horrified,'' she said. ''It is a very dangerous concept, especially in terms of society's propensity for domestic violence.''
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Sorry to see that. It seems the religious in Australia look to America for inspiration.
Here in the USA even politicians can get away with telling women who leave violent abusers that they're "bad mothers" and "you married him for a reason" to "if it's really rape then you can't conceive" and still do well in the polls. You should see some of the things Romney's VP pick has said and sponsored (like the "personhood bill" that would grant fetuses personhood at the moment of conception as well as the "Save Life Act" which meant if giving birth would mean the mother dies then a religious hospital doesn't have to do anything to save her, but you have to understand, pro-life isn't about protecting innocent babies, it's about punishing women). And here in the USA they're considered mainstream, not fringe, and many also say such people are "moderates." So all in all y'all are still doing better than us.
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I don't understand where this comes from, I grew up in the church and got "saved" at 8. by 15 I had read most of the bible and believed Christianity to be based on the teachings of Jesus loving one another and doing more for others than you would yourself. clearly the church isn't interested in doing any of that.
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08-25-2012, 07:09 AM
(Edited 08-25-2012, 07:12 AM by Genersis.)
I love the way they say "submit" is a "deeply biblical word".
Yeah, um, not sure you realise how bad that sounds, and how it sounds worse than "obey".
I thought the majority of churches were trying to move away from the "expecting submission and obedience to it" thing.
Silly Sarcastic So-and-so
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Nothing suprises me when it comes to organise religion these days. I don't know what is worse - a tax free business...sorry, CHURCH, or those that 'submit' to throw back business's...(oh dear, can't get my head around it)...CHURCH that spruik inequality.
Nothing against religion, just the business's that pop up around religion and then get the benefit of a tax free business and exemption from the law of the land that the rest of us have to abide by.
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Wow, bad indeed. Take me, I am a Dom/Master as far as BDSM goes (that stands for Bondage, Domination, Submission, Masochism) Now it can be done responsibly and with consent, without abusing or demeaning the submissive BUT not without training, agreements and serious discussion BEFORE you submit to a Dom.
Yes it happens, and yes there are bad Doms, subs end up traumatized, degraded and devalued to the point of needing intensive therapy or committing suicide when it goes wrong. The bottom line is a Dom/sub relationship with an uneducated or selfish, careless Dom, or without proper discussion and consent is abuse of the worst kind.
That is basically what this is opening the door for, letting husbands think they are the Dominant, that they are supposed to dominate their wives who are suppose to submit, give up and take it. How any of those husbands to you think have even read a Dominant's creed and, even if they have how many are going to take it to heart and live by it? Not many because they don't know they should when someone willing submits to them.
The Dominant’s Creed
Author unknown
Above all else, a Dominant cherishes their submissive in the knowledge that the gift the submissive gives is the greatest gift of all.
A Dominant is demanding and takes full advantage of the power they hold, but knows how to share the pleasure that comes from such power over another.
A Dominant is in control of themselves first and foremost, so that they may control others.
As a stern and demanding Dominant, they can cause their submissive to cry real tears; As a consummate lover, they will kiss such tears away without stepping out of character.
In times of trouble, a Dominant will leave the roles behind and be a supportive friend and partner, never forgetting that this is still a loving relationship between two individuals.
A Dominant is quick to understand the differences between fantasy and reality.
A Dominant will never ask a submissive to put them before the submissive’s career or family just to satisfy their own pleasure.
To win a submissive’s mind, body, spirit, soul and love, a Dominant knows they must first win the submissive’s trust.
A Dominant will show their submissive humour, kindness and warmth.
A Dominant must always show their submissive that their guidance and tutoring is knowledgeable and deserving of the submissive’s attention, that the Dominant is a person they can learn from in in whom they can trust their direction.
A Dominant is romantic enough to be protective and chivalrous. When called upon, they will fight for their submissive’s honour.
A Dominant proves to their submissive that they are someone who can be leaned upon and depended upon.
When it comes time to teach their submissive a lesson is obedience, a Dominant is a strong and unyielding teacher.
A Dominant will accept no flaw; nothing less than perfection from their student.
Never does a Dominant use discipline without good reason. When they punish their submissive it is always with a knowledgeable and careful hand.
A Dominant is always open to communication and discussion; always ready to hear their submissive’s wants and needs.
A Dominant is patient, taking time to learn their submissive’s limits and knowing that as the submissive’s trust in them grows, so to will they grow.
A Dominant never has to demand ritual behaviour from their submissive. Their submissive responds to them out of the want of pleasing them. Compliance comes from the desire to please, not the fear of punishment.
A Dominant understand the fragile nature of mind and body and never violates the trust given to them.
A Dominant is secure enough to laugh at themselves and the absurdities of life; open-minded enough to learn new things. Strong enough to grow.
A Dominant’s tools are mind, body, spirit, soul and love.
A Dominant understands that E/each partner gains most from pleasuring the O/other. And B/both of T/them know that love and trust are the only bonds that truly hold.
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Wow, bad indeed. Take me, I am a Dom/Master as far as BDSM goes (that stands for Bondage, Domination, Submission, Masochism) Now it can be done responsibly and with consent, without abusing or demeaning the submissive BUT not without training, agreements and serious discussion BEFORE you submit to a Dom.
The "S" is commonly referred to as "sadism".,..not submission (HUGE Difference) and the "D" is not Dominant...it is Discipline...Bondage and Discipline...a significant difference. I have been involved in dominant and submissive relationships that NEVER involve BDSM and all four of those things are completely off limits for me...in fact I have had to tell alot of men over the years that I dont' play "dress up" ...I only like Dominant or Submissive behavoir when it is a state of being or mind rather than an image and when both roles are interchangable...my goal is for the roles to be reversed and ultimately equal and in the absense of that aspect I have no use for it. I use it to achieve balance and tantra.
Not all dominant and submissive dynamics in relationships are about controlling or torturing or disciplining others...that is alot like the church actually. For me...there are never any masters or slaves...
Which brings me to the topic at hand...Organized religion is about control and when they think they are losing control they ramp it up. Here in the US the war on women and gays is heating up with the church and the Republicans in bed together. I am sorry it is spreading....
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"If Jesus came back today, and saw what was going on in his name, he'd never stop throwing up".
Max von Sydow
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That depends on when you got into BDSM and, yes today you are right, Sadism is the modern, but originally it was submission and, for those of us that are still old leather, it was and is submission. Sometimes we get to politically correct, But I, and many others think Sadism needs reversed to the original.
A sadist rarely makes a good Dom/Master. Yes causing pain is a part of what we do, be that to enhance pleasure, or as punishment, but those that are driven by and, derive the majority of their pleasure form causing others pain need to go. Edgeplay (RACK) is one thing, getting off while your sub is in tears and not enjoying it one bit is another.
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all this sub/ dom thing sounds absolutly horrific to me, that someone would want to inflict pain and suffering on someone using the love/relashionship title is gross, if someone is asking to be beaten or tortured then something has gone wrong with their love map as they have grown and they need help - the dom who enjoys inflicting these acts surly can only be described as a sadist ?? not trying to piss anyone off but these are my thoughts on the subject....
as for the church, they are basically protecting their buisness which is what it , keeping women down has been done for centurys, they dont want to loose their dominance in their own organisastion, plus women in their little gang my start to question all the child abuse these holy men enjoy !!
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