Feminism and hatred towards feminism

[SolemnBoy]

How society exists? What about when society first began, and all through history. Society does not appear from thin air. It is the natural product of things.

How society IS not how it exists. I... you're quoting me with things I didn't even say to begin with.

[partisan]

Am i? Well im not really with it today? I like people who stand up for all people, not half of all people, in todays world they achieve nothing.

Still believe men have more ideals and our braver.

[SolemnBoy]

Am i? Well im not really with it today? I like people who stand up for all people, not half of all people, in todays world they achieve nothing.

Still believe men have more ideals and are braver

Not trying to be rude or anything but if opinions like that still exist I'd say that's just another argument for why it's needed. And the good (or might as well say REAL) feminists do stand up for both genders.

[partisan]

Bravery comes in many forms, theres bravery when a catastrophe falls on us, and we have to be brave, like a illness, discrimination whatever. You could say it was brave for victorian women to wear corsets that physically altered there bodys, they were so tight, or a thousand other examples, and muc better examples than that. I mean men in general, will be braver for an ideal. On the other hand woman have better virtues in other ways. It proberley all evens out in some beautifull harmonic way. What i mean is - how equall can it get? And what will be sacrificed to get there? And you cant change human nature.

[SolemnBoy]

Bravery comes in many forms, theres bravery when a catastrophe falls on us, and we have to be brave, like a illness, discrimination whatever. You could say it was brave for victorian women to wear corsets that physically altered there bodys, they were so tight, or a thousand other examples, and muc better examples than that. I mean men in general, will be braver for an ideal. On the other hand woman have better virtues in other ways. It proberley all evens out in some beautifull harmonic way. What i mean is - how equall can it get? And what will be sacrificed to get there? And you cant change human nature.

Could you explain why women have better virtues and why men are braver for ideals please?

[partisan]

Men are more on ideals, and woman more here and now, organising, and caring, fairer sex, while man is considered the braver sex, as in, the man will protect the woman from the lion, of course that is cliché but that's how it can be don't you think? (Generally) and im so glad we are were we are now but like Geri Halliwell said "its equall isn't it?"
If agree of course, women should have same job oppurtunity as men, but based on merit only, not simply filling a quota?

[SolemnBoy]

Men are more on ideals, and woman more here and now, organising, and caring, fairer sex, while man is considered the braver sex, as in, the man will protect the woman from the lion, of course that is cliché but that's how it can be don't you think? (Generally) and im so glad we are were we are now but like Geri Halliwell said "its equall isn't it?"
If agree of course, women should have same job oppurtunity as men, but based on merit only, not simply filling a quota?

I disagree with everything you said except the last part :3 but let's just agree to disagree.

[Pix]

When I hold a door open for a woman, I do so merely as a gesture of simple kindness. I am NOT implying they are weaker or can not do things for themselves. I am NOT trying to perpetuate some notion of Victorian chivalry....I am just trying to be polite....and when some loudmouth gets in my face and starts berating me as a chauvinist pig for holding a door open....I tend to get a little pissed.

I've never seen it happen, but if I do I will surely speak up. Of course I hold the door open for anyone behind me, including men, as it's just polite consideration and not demeaning. I admit that I do think it's more necessary to do so for small children and elderly, but I also think that if I live to where my body is breaking down and I'm wracked with arthritis then I hope someone is understanding to me when I'm that age, too.

I'm not sure what sort of debate this is supposed to create but in any case I think it's one worth having. Hatred towards feminism is growing and seems to have reached pretty extreme heights. Once again, people fail at differentiating between the bad feminists and the good feminists. Even the good ones face a lot of harrassment, getting called ugly dykes who "need to get laid" or "lose the stick up their ass". A woman calling herself a feminist is bound to get at least one degrading comment about it.

My message is basically finished but just to clarify once more to avoid misunderstandings:

Bad feminist 1: All men are rapists, destroy the patriarchy, it's women's turn to rule now!
Bad feminist 2: I want equality but men who won't pay for my dinner are dicks.

Good feminist: I just want complete gender equality.

Yeah, I find the hatred of feminism and women in general in the most surprising places...including from women. But at least you avoided a common mistake: you see that there are separate types of feminism. Unfortunately bad feminism 1 gets all the attention because it sells to those who love to hate and/or prone to fear & insecurity (and thus glued to the media and thus able to sell advertising spots for more) and also because those who hate feminists can use them as strawman (or is that straw womyn?) to attack the more reasonable and moderate ones.

Of course. I'm the same. All the self-proclaimed feminists in my class have Bella as their rolemodel and expect their boyfriends to pay for their stuff

BWHAHAHAHA!!!

I recall how I was disturbed when my then 12-year-old loaned me her copy of Twilight and I read of the very popular couple. I did NOT want her to see Bella as any kind of role model or Edward as good boyfriend material...luckily, I've seemed to have succeeded in inspiring her to want better for herself (in part, thanks to Buffy the Vampire Slayer, see below).

And now to use that snip to share 2 things...one is Ms. Magazine (mainstream feminist magazine in the USA) commenting on how anti-feminist Twilight is (in reviewing The Host), and the other is one of my favorite YT vids, Buffy vs. Edward:

[SolemnBoy]

I've never seen it happen, but if I do I will surely speak up. Of course I hold the door open for anyone behind me, including men, as it's just polite consideration and not demeaning. I admit that I do think it's more necessary to do so for small children and elderly, but I also think that if I live to where my body is breaking down and I'm wracked with arthritis then I hope someone is understanding to me when I'm that age, too.



Yeah, I find the hatred of feminism and women in general in the most surprising places...including from women. But at least you avoided a common mistake: you see that there are separate types of feminism. Unfortunately bad feminism 1 gets all the attention because it sells to those who love to hate and/or prone to fear & insecurity (and thus glued to the media and thus able to sell advertising spots for more) and also because those who hate feminists can use them as strawman (or is that straw womyn?) to attack the more reasonable and moderate ones.



BWHAHAHAHA!!!

I recall how I was disturbed when my then 12-year-old loaned me her copy of Twilight and I read of the very popular couple. I did NOT want her to see Bella as any kind of role model or Edward as good boyfriend material...luckily, I've seemed to have succeeded in inspiring her to want better for herself (in part, thanks to Buffy the Vampire Slayer, see below).

And now to use that snip to share 2 things...one is Ms. Magazine (mainstream feminist magazine in the USA) commenting on how anti-feminist Twilight is (in reviewing The Host), and the other is one of my favorite YT vids, Buffy vs. Edward:

Haha I liked that video a lot too. I've actually never seen Buffy but I've only heard good things about it. Perhaps it's worth checking out!

Bad feminism 1 is definitely infuriating. The problem is that the lines between good and bad feminism are getting blurrier to people. I've seen lots of otherwise openminded and intelligent people who completely generalize feminism as a whole in... well, not very charming ways.

[MisterTinkles]

Ive worked with feminists and have a good friend who is a die hard feminist, but she isnt one of these bra burning, man demeaning women. She is married with kids, but she only has problems when she sees women being taken advantage of. This story would make her scream and shout and write some pretty nasty letters.

It is my opinion that "sexually liberated" countries are only that way, so men CAN get away with beating their wives and kids, cheating on their wives, and raping any female they want. And to me, these pieces of human garbage need to be hung from very tall trees, in public places, so everybody can see that it is not a "mans world" after all. Those who make the laws should be hanged by them.

Would this judge pass the same verdict if it was HIS daughter that was raped????

Sometimes I am SOOOOO embarrassed to be a man!