My family are assholes

[matty7]

bravo for raising your family so well - you can pick your friends as they say but not your family ,, and its great that you and your daughter have such a great relationship

[nfisher1226]

My sister in law has an openly gay cousin who my brother knows and supposedly likes. He is also friends with my dad's old neighbors, who were a lesbian couple. He's a two faced dick on this issue.

Also I'm not taking the credit for my daughter's behavior because she and I spent so long apart. She's simply an amazing person with a lot of inner strength. I think it's a testament to how close of a bond we had when she was little though, that we were able to pick up so well where we left off so many years ago. When I have something to say, she listens. Intelligently. I try to do the same for her.

As in all things the crappy feeling has been subsiding since I got away. I have the luxury of living over an hour from my closest relative - something that wasn't entirely on accident. They're close enough to visit occasionally, yet far enough away to avoid having too much influence on my day to day life.

On the other side of my family there are actually a few people who are in the know about me. I've been slowly living more openly over the last few years. But really, every time I think I'm ready to come the rest of the way out of hiding something happens which makes me realize why I never have. It also makes me want to smash someone's face occasionally. I'm tired of feeling like I have anything to hide. The stupid thing is, the people who matter most already know and accept me for who I am. For some reason it's the ones who wouldn't be that great a loss that I've been holding out on telling. It's pretty stupid really.

[EvenOlderButWiser]

First off, congratulations on having such an amazing daughter, there is no doubt that as she matures she will be very much on your side

Unfortunately as someone mentioned earlier, you can choose your friends but you can't choose your family.

Your doing all the right things just now, and the good thing is (I hope) you only have to put up with this homophobic shit once a year.

What you have to focus on is the coming out when your ready part.

You mentioned you have a partner, where was he in all this, and is he aware of the challenges you face when at family gatherings?

If I were you - and this has to be entirely your decision of course, and when your ready - at next thanksgiving, Id plan your coming out ceremony ;-) Plan all the detail, and make sure your daughter and partner are part of the planning, as well as prepared for the potential negative reaction.

Of course your going to be "late" for some reason you guys can work out later. But can you imagine their reactions when you walk in, with everyone already gathered, and you have your daughter AND your partner with you. OMG some of them will fall off their chairs with apoplexy when you introduce him - it will be hilarious, and a Thanksgiving none of them will forget in a hurry. Coming out at such a gathering means you only have to do it once!

You sound like a great guy, theres many people who would not have remained as calm as you under such circumstances.

i wish you every success as you continue to get things together



ObW
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[Joshular]

TBH I think not only my boots but my 3 brothers boots would be hitting chins. I'd kick a family member if they talked like that in front of me. I don't care how old they are or how close to them I am.

[MisterTinkles]

[princealbertofb]

Josh is still an angry (it's either black or white) young man. Supportive though it may be, it's not a practical solution in real life, where nuance sometimes gets the job done, gradually, pragmatically, little by little.

You, nfisher, have learnt the details of the gay half-closeted, half-out life that many of us still live. This is the part that the younger generation don't necessarily understand, while egging us on to come out. As long as we can get by being open to those who'll understand and support us, there is no real reason for gathering grief from those who can only show disapproval at best and righteous anger, misery and bashing at worst. There is still too much potential for threat out there, sometimes threats to our lives. The old self preservation of sanity and emotion remains a priority for us to be able to get along. Occasionally we'll have those spurts of self-worth that make us get angry and state the obvious, but mostly it's a tactical move not to provoke unduly. We know what we've got to lose and we know what we've got to gain.

I think if your brother doesn't realise the sort of person you are or if he's in denial of what he knows, maybe he's reacting like a jerk because he wants you to come out with the truth. What do you actually know he knows about you? What does he know from fellow members of the family or old friends that you both know? What proof has he garnered from his own experience living with you? What has he heard from your ex wife? One day that bubble might need bursting.

I'm not sure that I'd be so confrontational as ObW suggests. I would probably write him a letter explaining how I live and how I feel and how I didn't choose this to be my life but that's what it is. I would also explain how others have found a way to understand, and how some have now changed their outlook on life, on the diversity of sexual orientations, on the diversity of cultures, on those values that make America a great country, the right to "life, liberty and the pursuit of [one's] happiness". I would explain to him how hurt I have been from some of his past remarks. Maybe give a few examples. I'd tell him how it affects my daughter to listen to all this pointless and vilifying negativity. I would also reassure him as to the fact that I'm in a stable relationship and that I'm not engaging in all the things that people seem to think we get up to (that is, if this part is true for you), and that from now on I would only consider continuing having a brother to brother relationship if he was ready to accept me and my partner as part of his family. Otherwise, "Bye bye, so long, farewell, it's been nice knowing you." Maybe I would also question his stance and wonder if he'd been subjected to rather unpleasant experiences, but maybe that would be going too far. Maybe he's had to take a stance earlier in his life and he's not had the guts to stand up to the bullies, so he's sided with them? Who knows where all this comes from? Tell him you'd like to understand, because none of this makes sense to you, and it hurts, it hurts deeply... to the point where being by his side if like stabbing yourself in the back. But you want to live, you NEED to live.

You might also tell him you realise that he'll need time for this to sink in, and maybe for this to become acceptable to him in some way. If I were you, I would also address a letter to his wife containing more or less the same information. She doesn't seem to have the same approach, so maybe she could be a way of soothing all that hate and anger. They can work it out together and what implications that means for future family gatherings, including, some day, members of the family who die, and their funerals etc... Those are not times to be divided.

Writing this letter will require courage, yes, but maybe it'll focus the realisation of how much you need and want your brother in your life. Does this man "love" you, in any possible way? He might surprise you by his answer. If our parents, brothers and sisters have managed to shift their thinking when they've finally been told, isn't there hope that your brother might change too? You've got to give him the benefit of the doubt, I believe. He needs to understand, he needs to process it, and maybe his children's lives will be changed by the new deal. It's worth trying.
Good luck.

[princealbertofb]

Enlighten me and us Europeans. What's the Macy's Parade?

[EvenOlderButWiser]

Macy's is a big (famous) department store in NYC.

Macy's Parade is their annual Thanksgiving parade. Think of it being a little like the Lords Mayor parade we have in London every year....

ObW
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[princealbertofb]

I know what Macy's is, ObW, thanks. I wondered what their Parade was about... Been in the shop.

[ManicReptile21]

Why I would've dropped 1 extra laxative into the mixture for however many bathrooms were in the house. 1 bathroom= 2 laxes; 2 bathrooms=3 laxatives. I would wreck party and look all smug while doing it. You won't get away with those remarks and not feel the humiliation I feel when you're talking shit about me. So I will counter the shit talking with a nice dose of the culprits OWN SHIT. Always carry a 5 pack of laxatives to ANY FAMILY REUNION. Fire at will was all he wrote.