Things not going as well as one would wish

[princealbertofb]

Over the holidays my boyfriend (Marshlander) told me that Uganda had now adopted the anti-gay law and that it was waiting to be signed by the president which will make it enforceable. That's bad... really bad.
And then he also told me that Ghana was thinking of adopting harsher anti-gay laws too. All of this is probably the work of some gay hating religious faction from the USA (sadly their ideas have caught on).
On the good side, Richard Branson (Virgin) has decided not to do business with Uganda because of their laws, but as Marshlander points out, it doesn't stop him doing business with countries like Saudi Arabia and others like that where doing gay stuff is punishable by death... double standards.

So, my thinking is that we need to fight on for people in those countries not to be terrorised by their own governments and their own compatriots. Letters and petitions need to be signed. Just be aware of it. Read the press.
Happy New Year to all of us, and all of those who live in more dire circumstances.

[Ekwarph]

And then we dare to say that everything is acquired, we don't need to do anything since we have our rights at a given moment. For me, here are the evidence here that it's not the case and even today it can get even worse.
It's obvious but I think some people tend to forget it easily.

[Bowyn Aerrow]

I'm always of two minds when it comes to 'helping others' find their freedoms, become 'free' nations and the like.

The USA is a good example. No other nation came over and started the Revolutionary War, it has to start right there in the middle of the states and it has to be the people who stood up and said they had enough.

France is another good example, While France did kinda sort look at the USA as an example that really pushed things off, the reality is not other nation went into France and won France's Independence for them.

It was LGBT at Stonewall that rioted in 1969 from the USA who started the long war for rights for LGBT in the USA.

We see a butterfly struggling to leave its cocoon, something in us desires nothing more than help the butterfly through its struggle. But if we do help, that butterfly will not fully develop, it will not become its full potential. It might actually just up and die.

Rights and freedoms are not 'God Given' - they are not even 'rights' as in everyone automatically gets them. History demonstrates that for humanity Rights and Freedoms are luxuries afforded only to those who live in a rich/wealthy society with leisure time to actually waste precious moments infighting over such things as the 'equality of man' infighting and defining such terms as what equality means and what man means.

Republics and Democracies are the exception, not the norm - not if you consider the whole of human history. Freedom and Equality are brand spanking new concepts which didn't actually take hold as germinated seed until the Industrial Revolution allowed humans the time to sit around and think about the more sociological and philosophical applications of words like 'Created Equal' and the implications of 'All Men'.

300 years ago 'all men are created equal' meant white, land owning males - only. It took a few centuries before 'all men' 'all humans'.

Sudan is undergoing its own social changes and is finding the luxury time to actually sit there and think about what equality means. Sudan was established 1956. The US 1776. 58 years in to its lifespan, its pretty far ahead than the United States were at their 58th year. the USA had absolutely no rights afforded to the common land renting man, or woman, or gay, or any minority.

The process for America to get from there to Stonewall Riots took 193 years. Using America as a model, Sudan still has about 135 years to go.

Yes I know its the 21st century and people should know better. Well they don't, humans never know better instantly, humans rarely take the easy way - its humans being human.

Sudan, South Africa, Russia, all of these places that are making laws opposed to Homosexuality just need to go through their processes and their people need to get a belly full and decide when its time to riot, or take up arms and by opposing end those tyrannies.

Should we letter write? I honestly wonder if that is a wise idea. It has been my personal experience that 'argument' tends to cause people to shore up their walls and become more staunchly entrenched in their ideologies. For every one cleric I 'won over' to the idea that LGBT are 'equal' in God's Eyes, ten others got a wild hair up their arse that I was attacking the very fabric of the Universe and playing Satan and they became more set in the idea that they must hold to their way of thinking or lose against Satan himself.

Now we all know that some Republicans in the USA are making wars in Africa against LGBT. I assure you these Republicans are beyond reasoning. Writing nice letters to them asking them to please stop or explaining that all humans are red on the inside or all of that other stuff will not change their mind.

There are only two ways to change their mind.

1. Vote them out of office.
2. Kill them.

I personally prefer option 2 as it sends a clearer message. It worked well for the French with the guillotine, France's Government still fears its people (as governments should) USA government, not enough fear there.

[dfiant1]

I have used Virgin Mobile and Virgin blue on the impression that they offer great service, but budget comes at a cost as apparently you can only employ cunts for minimum wage to be able to make yourself budget like. It' a half arsed company.

Richard Bransons ideas made him rich, not a decent person, a RICH person. Think he and people like him give a fuck about you, me and our rights? Only if it mean $$$$ for him....Just imagine if he stopped service flights to Saudi Arabia...he would lose millions and another airline would just fill his spot.

Stop servicing Uganda and Ghana? Virgin probably NEVER serviced those routes to start with...but gee that Richard Branson is a nice fellow for standing up for our rights...I'm going to fly Virgin for now on.

I am going to call Richard Branson out, like I did 30 years ago when every thought he was 'amazing'....RICHARD BRANSON...YOU'RE A CUNT. Your verbal retoric would bring Klennex toilet paper to it knees and deprive us honest people the right to wipe our arses with something soft....and 3 ply.

[dfiant1]

ok Who is next?

[princealbertofb]

I'll try not to throw the baby out with the bathwater.... If Richard Branson is not investing in Uganda and Ghana for reasons of ethics, it's a start... it may not be very honest but it's a start. Let's see what else he does to further the cause before we gun him down. There's only so much a person can do in one 24-hour day.

[princealbertofb]

Bowyn, not sure what you mean when you say that freedom and equality are brand new concepts... Surely they existed in antiquity. Explain what version of equality and freedom you mean.

[princealbertofb]

I still marvel at how cohesive our societies are through our laws and constitutions... etc... All our peace is linked to a promise we make to ourselves and others of applying the laws and respecting them.... In fact there's nothing that obliges anyone to comply except our own mental and moral fabric and values.... Interesting, n'est-ce pas? All of these ideas of equality are so tenuous (but good).

[southbiochem]

All of this is probably the work of some gay hating religious faction from the USA (sadly their ideas have caught on).

Oh, yes...Fred Phelps and his lovely work, for example...

I don't really know whether to cry or to fly to Uganda and cut open some throats...and bathe in the blood of extremist religious groups and extremist politicians

And you're right...bussineses will be made, as the oligarchic elites care not about whom they do it with, but rather how much money they can make..

[nfisher1226]

Not long ago we had a newcomer post about being persecuted in Eastern Europe. Georgia to be exact. It actually sounded to me like his life was in danger unless he could get asylum in a more progressive country.

Sad part is, he fell off the face of the earth so far as this forum is concerned. We have no way of knowing what happened to him.

While I get what BA is saying, and it has some definite merit, it's also impossible to deny that the world is a smaller place now than it was when the USA was young and the French had their own revolution. We can talk to these people now directly, in real time, for one thing. For another thing, economies are truly global and depend on one another in a way that is unprecedented in human history. There is a definite trend here. We're all becoming more connected to each other than we used to be.

I don't think we of the more enlightened nations of the earth can interfere directly at this point. However, there are things we can and should do to put pressure on the dickwads who want to hang on to such narrow views and hurt people. We can't just turn a blind eye and say they have to sort this out for themselves. People's lives are at stake.