"Date" walked away in the middle of dinner...

[trywait]

There is nothing to say that a crime cannot be someone's fetish. Rape can be a fetish. Heaven knows the porn industry thinks so.

Public sex is illegal in most places, but it is surely a fetish for some.

Snuff films exist. That means murder can be a fetish.

A fetish is a fetish because it excites someone sexually. It has no inherent virtue or morality or immorality. It's application to a man's preferences is independent of, but not beyond the reach of, the law.

i have to disagree. when a "fetish" crosses into "endangering" someone else, it is no longer okay. no matter the context. sex, in whatever form it is, needs to be consensual. the minute it is no longer consensual, you're bordering on psychosis and really need some mental help.

for example, if you know you're catching your "thrills" on raping individuals, identify that is not acceptable behavior and get some help! don't use your inability to control your urges as an excuse. it's your mind and body; find someway to control those urges.

as for that "porn industry" you mention, that is in the context of "fiction." it is not real life. some may contend that porn is "art." to each their own. regardless, it is in the context of a "controlled" environment, no matter how "documentary" it can get.

then again, I've digressed from Derek's original post. back to the beginning.

[bort]

I think he did you a favor when he got up and left.

[dynamodean]

Glad you are only out the price of a dinner and no real harm. Stick to your guns. Keep telling 'em that they're sick when they are. Immoral is immoral. Judging is a relative accusation. Thieves, rapists, pedophiles, and bankers all use it variously.

Thanks. I always speak my mind and if it's me passing judgment then so be it. I respect differences but not when there is no respect for others.

[dynamodean]

Never stick your dick in crazy.

And to think what could have happened if he had kept that part of his fetish a secret...

Wow Derek I am glad it blew up at the restaurant before he took you to his place and something bad happened there. Consider yourself lucky. The guy sounds unstable.

I don't think I'll change but this incident definitely opened my eyes on the potential dangers of casual sex as a "first date". But hey, life is all about calculated risks, right?

[dynamodean]

To me, knowing in advance that he was hypersexual, would have been a red flag. I have a strong sex drive and am no prude, but to me being hypersexual means more than just super horny. It would mean abnormal or obsessive to me. I think I would almost be looking for him to reveal such shit about himself and to be upfront about it. And when it's common knowledge about a person, it's probably an indication of their character. If he told you about this on a first date then he tells everyone.

It's good that you got away with only the bill for dinner. Your virginity is intact.

I don't think hypersexuality is cause for concern. If it is attached to a dignified and respectful individual then all that energy can be harnessed in a positive way. The way my friend described him, I had envisioned a guy with a healthy sexual appetite that just happens to enjoy sex a lot.

Of course, I don't know why my friend thinks I'd be a great match for him. He know I enjoy sex, a lot...but...

[dynamodean]

It is interesting that your friend thought he was OK to set you up with and that your impression was so very different. That makes me think your friend really does not know the guy or that your date is very two-faced. Best to avoid. Getting stiffed for the check is a small price to pay.

Or, my friend should know me better. But I do think this guy has a bit of Dr. Jekyll/Mr. Hyde thing going on with him. He actually seemed sane before he got all creepy on me. It was like a flip switched and he got himself more and more excited.

you didn't do anything wrong from what i gather from your description. the guy overreacted. and, from your description, it sounds like you're better off. i wouldn't take it too seriously. whatever his problem was it was his problem.

also, what [MENTION=18508]East[/MENTION] said. spiked drinks? that is unacceptable. no discussion about it. i probably would have gotten up and walked out myself at that and left him to pay the bill.

on a side note, personal chemistry is a very important indicator. it doesn't have to be the intensest chemistry you've ever had with a guy, but something should be there. if it's not....i've found guys like that and me don't fit either.

I wanted to walk away but I didn't. I was about to, but he beat me to the punch.

[dynamodean]

I'm drinking a beer but let me get this clear.


The conversation eventually delved more and more into his favorite sexual positions,
his S&M tendencies, and how he likes to spike drinks (what?!)...


Now I don't mind having sex on the first date or using sex as a way to get to know someone better,
or heck, use each others bodies to get off...but I didn't agree with or share some of his fetishes



I joked with him that he may have to teach me some of his moves....



so .... hes telling you what a slut he is and how he likes to spike drinks and what not.
but he gets offended when you say he could teach you some things?????

and your like sure lets have sex and figure the rest out later.


so you want to sleep with him but hes offended that he just told you that he rapes people????

let me finish this beer....

this is to strange for me to reply.


i just want to drink my beer.

No, I did not want to sex with him. Never in a million years. I leave the option open whenever I meet people (I don't need to wait until the X number of dates, etc) but after he opened up his pandora's box, I would never get into bed with him, with or without my consent.

[TwisttheLeaf]

Dude's a creep. Good riddance, man.

[bluerealm]

No, I did not want to sex with him. Never in a million years. I leave the option open whenever I meet people (I don't need to wait until the X number of dates, etc) but after he opened up his pandora's box, I would never get into bed with him, with or without my consent.

i was trying to word it to be funny.

someone said don't put your dick into crazy. LOLOLOl

i can't top that!

but i do like your laid back free spirit. you sound like fun.

[Hardheaded1]

I have to disagree. When a "fetish" crosses into "endangering" someone else, it is no longer okay. Mo matter the context. Sex, in whatever form it is, needs to be consensual. The minute it is no longer consensual, you're bordering on psychosis and really need some mental help.

For example, if you know you're catching your "thrills" on raping individuals, identify that is not acceptable behavior and get some help! Don't use your inability to control your urges as an excuse. It's your mind and body; find someway to control those urges.

Whoever said all fetishes are ok? Being a fetish isn't some class of sacrosanct feelings or rights. A fetish is a fetish, period. It turns someone on, period. It's not like free speech or some inalienable right. It's not ok just because it's a fetish. It's a fetish. And it is perfectly ok to condemn fetishes if they conflict with our values. I don't approve of any S&M as I don't think it is ever acceptable to physically hurt or torture another person, regardless of consent. But I balance that condemnation with the acknowledgment that people have the right to be wrong, so I don't lobby against S&M.

As for that "porn industry" you mention, that is in the context of "fiction." It is not real life. Some may contend that porn is "art." To each their own. Regardless, it is in the context of a "controlled" environment, no matter how "documentary" it can get.

Being art or not is irrelevant. The fact that the porn industry portrays rape as a fantasy turn-on (not the same thing as a fetish, btw), means it is a recognized turn-on. The proliferation of rape depictions in gay porn means it is successful enough to keep marketing to. There are many things depicted in fiction and porn that are not "valid" such as approaching a pizza delivery boy for sex, but validity isn't the point in question. It's whether a fetish is possibly criminal, and I say that it of course is possible for it to be both. I haven't read a response that puts up a credible argument refuting that.

Then again, I've digressed from Derek's original post. back to the beginning.

Fetish and criminal behavior ARE the topic as introduced in Derek's post. The exemplar is his rude date. It's all on topic.