Monogamy expectations

[Pacific]

Do a lot of male-male relationships struggle with this? I've been in my relationship for 5 years and I am to the point where I understand I cannot even expect much in this area. At this point, you're thinking why am I still in the relationship, but I really do love my partner and we're compatible on so many levels. I know so many gay relationships seem to be open and wonder if this is something I should just mellow out on? If it's so common, is the fact that he gets some on the side without telling me something to be worried about if I know he loves me? We've been "open" but we had an agreement to let the other know prior to anything happening. Well, apparently, this is not been followed. Personally, I am for some odd reason angry but also sympathetic thinking that if I ask him to tell me first, perhaps that's just awkward and I suppose I can see how it would take away from the experience(?). I just am pretty peeved that the rules weren't followed (I am pretty OCD about rules)...it triggers a lot of anxiety and other negative feelings.

Anyway, thoughts, insight, been-there before stories, would be helpful.

Thanks

[TwisttheLeaf]

If it's so common, is the fact that he gets some on the side without telling me something to be worried about if I know he loves me? We've been "open" but we had an agreement to let the other know prior to anything happening. Well, apparently, this is not been followed.

So.... is he telling you -afterward- or just not telling you at all?

If you agreed to this arrangement and it's not working for you, then maybe it's time to sit down with him and tell him you need to adjust the arrangement, that it's not working for you.

As for prior knowledge vs knowledge after the fact... I would expect that there are times he doesn't KNOW he's going to be getting laid until it's too late unless you want a text saying "I'm getting laid in about 30 seconds. See you when I get home."

Seriously callous, right?

Still, as I said. The arrangement isn't working for you. Not everyone is into open relationships, man. Gideon isn't, and it turns out that with [MENTION=20938]Gideon[/MENTION]? Neither am I. There's plenty of gay men out there that are wired to be possessive about their partner.

So.... if the talk doesn't work, and neither does the current situation.... it's time to change the situation and move on. IMO, of course.

[Anocxu]

This is a sensitive issue ..
It's not the same as forgetting to put the toilet seat down...
Or forgetting to put out the trash on garbage day..
This is about sexual interactions outside the relationship so communication has to be pristine...

You have every right to be upset..

On the other hand opening up a relationship has become very trendy for gay men...(especially here in FTL .Florida OMG!)

Open relationships are not for everyone...
Only solid couples do well at open relationships.

If your relationship needs tons of work... Introducing open status will most likely make it worse..

I have questions for you...

1) How do you intend on rectifying his inconsistencies?

2) Have you had a talk with him regarding this issue?

3) Are you happy in the relationship?

4) How is the sex?

5) Is your significant other willing to do some work to make things better?

If you answer these questions..

It will shed some light on what it might take to get you two back on track...
It will also help the other guys posting to give you better advice than I have..

Ps.
Darius cries when he ejaculates...

[Pacific]

Thanks. I've answered the questions below.

This is a sensitive issue ..
It's not the same as forgetting to put the toilet seat down...
Or forgetting to put out the trash on garbage day..
This is about sexual interactions outside the relationship so communication has to be pristine...

You have every right to be upset..

On the other hand opening up a relationship has become very trendy for gay men...(especially here in FTL .Florida OMG!)

Open relationships are not for everyone...
Only solid couples do well at open relationships.

If your relationship needs tons of work... Introducing open status will most likely make it worse..

I have questions for you...

1) How do you intend on rectifying his inconsistencies?
I don't know yet. It's happened many times, so I do not want another promise that the rules will be followed--I won't belevie it. Breaking up just seems harsh when I really love him and enjoy life with him otherwise.

2) Have you had a talk with him regarding this issue?
Yes, more than once we have dealth with this

3) Are you happy in the relationship?
Yes, if it weren't for this, I would be pretty happy.

4) How is the sex?
It is great.

5) Is your significant other willing to do some work to make things better?

I know him well enough to know his intentions are good, but I really think he decides not to tell me to "protect" me or is afraid of how I will view him because he is a much more sexual person than I am and probably doesn't want to be telling me about all the sex he wants vs. the relatively low amount I would step outside the relationship for sex.



If you answer these questions..

It will shed some light on what it might take to get you two back on track...
It will also help the other guys posting to give you better advice than I have..

Ps.
Darius cries when he ejaculates...

[Pix]

What I don't get is that so many gay men complain of this, so obviously there are plenty of monogamous and faithful gay men out there, but y'all are having a hard time finding one another despite that plenty of people (gay and straight) are able to find such relationships.

Best I can figure is it's like with the straight women who also complain about it. They get played by players who can sense what you want and fake the fantasy, and the human mind loves to accept what it wishes were true even when it should know better (which is such a boon to con-artists of all types and why so many people succeed easier by telling people what they want to hear rather than what is the reality). Players aren't emotionally vested and thus not concerned with establishing things like trust so they're not afraid to tell you whatever you want to hear (or at least what they can get away with), only in being able to nibble the cheese as long as they can while already putting out feelers for new sources of cheese knowing that sooner or later their current cheese is going to be taken away. Cult of vulnerability and "we draw what we fear so we must have faith" aside, it pays to not feel guilty over using some common sense and caution.

That, and many women think they can change him with her love (it works in the romance fiction so apparently it should also work in real life) or they just want to be the flower that the men come to irresistibly drawn by her beauty and charms where she just waits for the men to come to her rather than doing any work herself (problem with that is the men most likely to come to them--especially in bars, on dating sites, etc--are the hunters aggressively looking for new conquests rather than the men who want something more, and women mistake these types of men as the ones "who are interested in me" when he's just drilling for a crack to use in as many places as he can), and the more she falls for that type of men the more players will hear of her from their fellow players that they like to keep score with (and they take note of what to say and do to get into her pants) and the more the monogamous men will shy away from her (even if he doesn't judge her for it he'll see her with "those kind of men" and think she wouldn't want anything to do with a man like him) in a vicious circle as she complains all men are cheating jerks despite that other women don't have a problem finding faithful men.

I don't know how much of that would apply to gay men as well but one thing I know the two have in common (because I've seen both do it, and threads here also make me think it) is that the major hotties often get to skip the vetting process everyone else gets (and is even praised for doing the same kind of things that would earn a less attractive man a restraining order or criminal charges). I don't know if it's some instinct that believes the body reflects the heart and spirit (like how to tell the good witches from the bad in Oz) or what but when the vetting process is that shallow then it seems natural that they'd get a lot of shallow (but hot) men, particularly those hotties who must at least be tempted by all the other shallow people drawn to them (and may even become cynical and jaded themselves believing they're only desired for their looks which everyone knows isn't going to last forever so best cash in on it now).

I'm just throwing that out there in case anything resonates. I do know that what you're looking for exists and that there are many other gay men (like straight women) frustrated by the same things you are and there must be a way for you to find each other as others interested in a faithful monogamous relationship have done.

[Darius]

You don't want an open relationship but you won't be honest about it, for whatever reason.
It's not going to get better and you might want to dump him before he dumps you...it will happen.

[Beaux]

What I don't get is that so many gay men complain of this, so obviously there are plenty of monogamous and faithful gay men out there, but y'all are having a hard time finding one another despite that plenty of people (gay and straight) are able to find such relationships.

Best I can figure is it's like with the straight women who also complain about it. They get played by players who can sense what you want and fake the fantasy, and the human mind loves to accept what it wishes were true even when it should know better (which is such a boon to con-artists of all types and why so many people succeed easier by telling people what they want to hear rather than what is the reality). Players aren't emotionally vested and thus not concerned with establishing things like trust so they're not afraid to tell you whatever you want to hear (or at least what they can get away with), only in being able to nibble the cheese as long as they can while already putting out feelers for new sources of cheese knowing that sooner or later their current cheese is going to be taken away. Cult of vulnerability and "we draw what we fear so we must have faith" aside, it pays to not feel guilty over using some common sense and caution.

That, and many women think they can change him with her love (it works in the romance fiction so apparently it should also work in real life) or they just want to be the flower that the men come to irresistibly drawn by her beauty and charms where she just waits for the men to come to her rather than doing any work herself (problem with that is the men most likely to come to them--especially in bars, on dating sites, etc--are the hunters aggressively looking for new conquests rather than the men who want something more, and women mistake these types of men as the ones "who are interested in me" when he's just drilling for a crack to use in as many places as he can), and the more she falls for that type of men the more players will hear of her from their fellow players that they like to keep score with (and they take note of what to say and do to get into her pants) and the more the monogamous men will shy away from her (even if he doesn't judge her for it he'll see her with "those kind of men" and think she wouldn't want anything to do with a man like him) in a vicious circle as she complains all men are cheating jerks despite that other women don't have a problem finding faithful men.

I don't know how much of that would apply to gay men as well but one thing I know the two have in common (because I've seen both do it, and threads here also make me think it) is that the major hotties often get to skip the vetting process everyone else gets (and is even praised for doing the same kind of things that would earn a less attractive man a restraining order or criminal charges). I don't know if it's some instinct that believes the body reflects the heart and spirit (like how to tell the good witches from the bad in Oz) or what but when the vetting process is that shallow then it seems natural that they'd get a lot of shallow (but hot) men, particularly those hotties who must at least be tempted by all the other shallow people drawn to them (and may even become cynical and jaded themselves believing they're only desired for their looks which everyone knows isn't going to last forever so best cash in on it now).

I'm just throwing that out there in case anything resonates. I do know that what you're looking for exists and that there are many other gay men (like straight women) frustrated by the same things you are and there must be a way for you to find each other as others interested in a faithful monogamous relationship have done.

NAIL. ON. HEAD.
~Beaux

[Jettalove]

This may or may not be helpful....I think others have made some great points already...but if you are inclined to want to keep trying at this, how about implementing a different rule: a "24 hour" rule where he needs to tell you about outside sex within 24 hours of it occurring? Personally I think the rule of telling you beforehand is way unrealistic- I think you even acknowledge this. This way, you'll be able to see if he does indeed respect you enough to at least follow a reasonable promise.

[putresVigil]

[COLOR="Sienna"]I am (or was) in a similar boat and I can say I am just as confused as you seem to be. That said, I am leery of him breaking the rules on you and not telling you before sex happens. Surely, if he is properly vetting the guys he could tell you beforehand - I assume he is not meeting and having sex with someone he meets on Grindr or something within seconds of them meeting. That seems dangerous. Not STD wise, since there are condoms, but just generally. For all he knows he could be meeting a guy who gets violent, or some serial killer meeting his victims that way, etc. I am way too neurotic to be okay with that, myself. You seem less so (which is probably a good thing, all considered).
[/COLOR]
Jettalove mentioned changing the rule up. That could work. It was mentioned he might be worried about hurting you if he is honest, but seems he is hurting you now by not telling. I would let him know this fact if you haven't already. Lack of communication is a real problem, believe me.

[Anocxu]

Hey Pacific...
I read the answers you wrote... I see now that you are truly at your breaking point.

The truth is..
You should not stay in a relationship in which you are constantly disrespected ...

If you have talked to him several times and nothing has changed...
It's time for you to make changes.

Any man that wants you to stay around would not intentionally make you unhappy...

The sex is great to you but not enough for him.

Your issues extend way beyond him getting some on the side..Clearly you are a very lenient guy...

I do not agree with the posters that are convincing you to change the rules.
..If the rules needed to be changed that should have been discussed in one of the many talks ...

If things do not change ...
Begin plotting your way out.