Vatican tells UN that critics of gays under attack

[Kiid]

Vatican: gay 'critics' under attack | Stuff.co.nz

Read. I yet have to but ish doing so now.

[Cardiganwearer]

The usual religious mo. Adopt a position, call it "moral", then you don't have to defend it with argument and you can claim to be a victim when someone questions that position. In the case of the catholic church it also helps to play down the long history of raping children.

[VonSteuben]

Of course critics of gays are attacked, because Europeans make it illegal for any free speech on the matter. As we have turned into a politically correct wasteland where people withhold their opinion instead of saying it, it's a far more dangerous place like that. The public opinion is far less potent than the private opinion. When times get tough the bottled up opinions are always the ones that people kill and die over. Freedom of speech goes both ways for those we agree with and don't.

[Cardiganwearer]

Perhaps you could point to the laws in Europe or any individual country therein which forbid freedom of speech on this issue.

Perhaps, too, you could explain why the Vatican is complaining about such speech if it is already supressed by law and therefore presumably not happening in the first place.

I would say much more but I am forbidden by my innate sense of politeness rather than any laws.

[East]

They are wrong...that is why they get attacked for their opinion. We attack Nazis and the KKK for their "opinion" too....when are they going to show up at the UN whining?

[marshlander]

Silvano Maria Tomasi at it again then! The man seems to have no moral character. Rather than diligently doing his best to tackle the business of rebuilding his thoroughly discredited organisation he lashes out by blaming others.

This quote from a 2009 Guardian article shows just what class the man has

The Vatican has lashed out at criticism over its handling of its paedophilia crisis by saying the Catholic church was "busy cleaning its own house" and that the problems with clerical sex abuse in other churches were as big, if not bigger.

In a defiant and provocative statement, issued following a meeting of the UN human rights council in Geneva, the Holy See said the majority of Catholic clergy who committed such acts were not paedophiles but homosexuals attracted to sex with adolescent males.

The statement, read out by Archbishop Silvano Tomasi, the Vatican's permanent observer to the UN, defended its record by claiming that "available research" showed that only 1.5%-5% of Catholic clergy were involved in child sex abuse.

He also quoted statistics from the Christian Scientist Monitor newspaper to show that most US churches being hit by child sex abuse allegations were Protestant and that sexual abuse within Jewish communities was common.

He added that sexual abuse was far more likely to be committed by family members, babysitters, friends, relatives or neighbours, and male children were quite often guilty of sexual molestation of other children.

I was going to quote from Geoffrey Robertson's excellent book, "The Case of the Pope", but it doesn't seem to have an index and I can't find the bit I was looking for at the moment. However, for Tomasi to go on the attack in the light of such devastating condemnations of the Catholic priesthood in Ireland as presented in the Ryan Report which called child abuse "endemic" shows a disgusting lack of judgement. Still since it's only 1.5%-5% of Catholic clergy engaged in abusing children that would be all right then :mad:

Mind you, isn't it just a little weird that Tomasi is only an official observer at the UN in Geneva on account of a deal done by Pope Pius XI with Mussolini? It is this treaty that bestows statehood on the Vatican and eventually brought the Pope to the UK at our expense last year to enlighten us all with his medieval views on our personal lives. Last I'd heard the Vatican had been invoiced for the £6m or so they had agreed to pay for last year's fiasco (out of the £30m bill), but hadn't actually got round to paying anything. Maybe they put the invoice in the file marked "child abuse cases".

(I'm confident Fred will put me right if I've made a mistake in the figures )

[Wintereis]

The only limitation on the freedom of speech I know of in western Europe is that you cannot deny that the holocaust happened in Germany. Well, I guess, in France you cannot wear a burka which is like a hybridized limitation of speech and religion. Those are the only ones I know of off hand. There may be more.

[simon]

love this quote

"Throughout the world, there is a consensus between societies that certain kinds of sexual behaviour must be forbidden by law. Paedophilia and incest are two examples"

by they are getting desperate, the words pot,kettle and black come to mind!

[VonSteuben]

Perhaps you could point to the laws in Europe or any individual country therein which forbid freedom of speech on this issue.

In Germany if a person says in public, "The Holocaust did not happen" they can go to jail. Why? Because of Inciting Racial and Religious Hatred Act of 2006.

The Racial and Religious Hatred Act 2006 (Commencement No.1) Order 2007

In Norway, legislation says, "Norway prohibits hate speech, and defines it as publicly making statements that threaten or ridicule someone or that incite hatred, persecution or contempt for someone due to their skin colour, ethnic origin, homosexual life style or orientation or, religion or philosophy of life." Norwegian Penal code, Straffeloven, section 135 a.

Public Order Act 1986
Criminal Justice and Public Order Act 1994
Crime and Disorder Act 1998
Amendment to Crime and Disorder Act 1998

All in UK are against speech against gays. So let me put it other terms, if in UK or Norway a priest speaks out against racial groups or other sexual orientations, then they will be jailed for "Inciting racial or religious hatred". Putting priests in jail helps gay causes? Not to me.

[posterpicture]

Well the difference is
I am gay and I don't want people who are from Catholic Church go to hell
They are Catholic and they want me to die in hell.