Is immigration within the EU too liberal?

[partis]

no its not

Because you know a lot about it! ?????

[stu]

Yes but who builds schools, roads, hospitals, etc. ?
I'm not sure the majority of them is the "good", "white" and "inoffensive" Europeans...at least in France, but I guess it's the same in GB. At least they are good excuses to say that it's not our fault if we don't find a job. But people will realize that closing doors of Europe will not resolve the problems.

Most are British but a good few are Polish although I've never seen any Romanians or Bulgarians on a building site. Generally the Polish are good, and inoffensive as is any other nationality (as far as I know). I've not got anything against any indivisual wanting to come to the UK to work even if they are only good and inoffensive but how many unskilled poorly educated manual workers can we take when we have millions of our own that can't find work. Most of these people will be on the minimum wage which is not enough to live on without getting benefits from the state.

[EvenOlderButWiser]

As far as I'm aware, the UK has never participated in the "right to travel and work freely within the European Union"

Well thats a load of bollox for a start. The UK is a fully integrated participant in Europe and has been since 1972. That includes the right to travel and work freely within the EU.

It's always had restrictions on immigrants moving to and working in the UK.

Correct, and it still does, for all non EU citizens.

It doesn't give benefits to anyone who happens to live here either.

Actually it does. Under the EU treaty each member country has to apply its social and welfare benefits to any other EU citizen who resides within the UK. The fact that the UK has significantly better social and welfare programs than most of the other EU countries is part of the problem. There is a significant imbalance between the poorer (new) EU entrants who have little or no social support programs and the UK. Thats why unemployed people from poorer economical countries are attracted to the UK. When it comes to housing however, each local council within the UK has the right to apply its own policies, which can differ between councils - but that policy has to be applied to EU immigrants as well as UK citizens.

If your an illegal immigrant, your not entitled to anything, unless you have applied and been accepted for asylum - which is nothing to do with the EU, but is covered by the UNHCR regulations. Most illegals do not claim benefit, as they can't provide the required paperwork and proof to accept their claim. Thats why they get exploited in some jobs and paid £1 an hour, cash in hand....Or turn to crime!

Also, it makes European Union look like the bad guy(maybe hoping to push people to vote for them for that referendum)

Actually it makes the UK look like the bad guy. We want to be in Europe, but we don't want to follow the rules we don't like. Thats not how the EU works.

Seeing all this makes me wonder what measures we have in place for non-EU immigrants.
They do make up the majority of immigrants after all.

Thats a load of bollox. The problem is illegal immigrants, there is a very big difference between legal immigrants from the EU, and illegal immigrants from outside who are trafficked into the UK by gangs for big money.

When the UK catches illegal immigrants, it takes action against them, including locking them up in detention centres followed by deportation. The problem is actually catching them, and applying the law with all the level challenges that brings (not to mention the money spinner for the lawyers involved)

As you can tell Im pro-Europe, and I have lived and worked extensively within the EU. I just wish people would get the facts right on the whole situation.

ObW
X

[Ekwarph]

Most are British but a good few are Polish although I've never seen any Romanians or Bulgarians on a building site. Generally the Polish are good, and inoffensive as is any other nationality (as far as I know). I've not got anything against any indivisual wanting to come to the UK to work even if they are only good and inoffensive but how many unskilled poorly educated manual workers can we take when we have millions of our own that can't find work. Most of these people will be on the minimum wage which is not enough to live on without getting benefits from the state.

What I "observe" here, is that lots of unemployed French people (just here I'll define French by having been there at least since two generations) are not ready to take any jobs. Unskilled people are probably more useful than a "uselessly" skilled person.

At least they work and have a wage, so they're useful to the country so it's not absurd to get benefits.
While others unemployed from EU, don't want to do jobs they consider "thankless".

After, you will always have those who take benefits from the system and just reach social helps without job...from the EU or immigrant. Not convinced it's a majority.

[Pix]

The UK is a fully integrated participant in Europe and has been since 1972

Doesn't the UK have a different currency from that of the EU? If so then how are they fully integrated? Can the UK spend their pounds in Berlin and Germans spend their Euros in London (or even some small town in the UK)?

Obviously I'm an American and the vast majority of our media rarely bothers to explain events outside of Washington DC (seriously, tornadoes coming down locally and yet the local news breaks are all about everyday BS going on in Washington DC thousands of miles away!) let alone outside the country. I realize it probably sounds like a stupid question to you but I'm genuinely trying to understand.

[EvenOlderButWiser]

Doesn't the UK have a different currency from that of the EU? If so then how are they fully integrated? Can the UK spend their pounds in Berlin and Germans spend their Euros in London (or even some small town in the UK)?

The Euro was only introduced in 2002 (or thereabouts) and each country was allowed to decide whether or not it wanted to participate. Only 17/28 of the EU members joined the Euro currency.

In the major UK cities you can shop in £ or Euro's although Euros are more easily accepted in the tourist destinations. You can shop in £ in most Eu capital cities, but the exchange rate is pretty rubbish.

ObW
X

[MisterLove]

Open all borders and inforce a common minimum wage in all EU countries. Problem solved.

[joseph]

Because you know a lot about it! ?????

yessssssssss

[Sylph]

So let me understand something?

The UK, after all it's historic spreading of it's legs, wants to now get a chastity belt?

Don't get me wrong, I find it great, mostly because I am myself a BoT Citizen or British Citizen, under the Overseas Territories legislation put into place when "Mother Eng- of- land" saw fit to commandeer my island after taking America, then Virginia, for herself some odd 400 years ago.

So basically saying, I can move to the UK and work and get a house and all that, because I am technically a citizen, but with some restrictions, less so than non-UK affiliated people, but even still, and we're not allowed to vote or have say in UK affairs, so I don't think we're part of the EU per se, however.

Would this type of thing just affect alllll EU people and people affiliated with the UK, such as the islands the UK has colonized or ?

Because while many of their ties with the islands have been severed, there are still some, such as Us, Cayman Islands, Turks and Caicos, Monsterrat (British Overseas Territory List


So for them to be fair, would they not have to bar us as well? They would have to also look outside of just EU members, as we can go there and basically do the same thing as EU members, aside from voting and all that, we can get jobs, obtain welfare and housing.

So I'm confused as to why they would even seek this type of move, without considering all factors of their actions, especially seeing as how they are the ones who in this specific case I'm making, put their foot in the shoe and colonized and made dependent ties(us on them, not reverse).

However I guess I can understand seeing as how our population is kinda steep for our size and we're facing similar problems with and not to sound overly racist, but primarily with Filipinos.

Because they work for less then we do, live maybe 4-5 in a 1 bedroom house, cutting down on economic input and send money back to the Philippines, further reversing economic proliferation. Everyone here has seen and knows this, so it's not like I'm trying to be racist and not every Filipino does this.

Being a Part of CARICOM(A sort of "European Union" for West Indians), Trinbagonians and other islanders can also come here and do the same thing, however, they tend to contribute more to our economy and also strengthen our cultural bonds(sorry, we're not asian >< and I.E - Reggae for instance)

So now we're trying to limit the people, even within Caricom to an extent, who can come and work here and rent houses and so on.

However the UK is different, mostly for the fact that they are much larger and essentially brought this issue on themselves. The way I see it, all they would have to do, is to only allow benefits and rights for their citizens and citizens upon whom they have ties with such as us, because places such as Italy and Poland are independent countries.

~

Small Fun Fact;


[COLOR="Blue"]St. George's town, in the Islands of Bermuda, or "The Somers Isles". The colony was founded by the wrecking of the flagship of the Virginia Company in 1609. The Company's charter was extended to include Bermuda in 1612, and it has remained an English (since 1707, British) colony ever since. Since the independence of Virginia, it has been the oldest-remaining British colony, and the town of St. George's is the oldest continuously inhabited English settlement in the New World.

Bermuda and Bermudians have played important, sometimes pivotal, but generally underestimated or unacknowledged roles in the shaping of the English and British trans-Atlantic Empires. These include maritime commerce, settlement of the continent and of the West Indies, and the projection of naval power via the colony's privateers, among other areas.[/COLOR]

So you're welcome Brits <3 We helped build your Commerce :3


lol

[Tulloni]

Its a difficult issue, but on the whole I am against the EU and the amount of immigration into the UK is absolutely stupid. When I go to Paris the predominate language I hear spoken on the streets is French, the mother language of France. When I walk around the streets of London do I hear much English spoken? No! I hear a lot of Polish, Farsi, Russian, Mandarin, Italian, Urdu, Spanish, etc. and not one word of English! You've now got the absurd situation of one street in a London surburb speaking Polish, the next street speaking mainly Russian, and the next street along speaking mainly Punjabi, etc. How does this encourage integration? Its full-scale ghetto-isation. I am sorry but there's no other word for it.

I find the idea of free movement offensive. There's no other word for it, the idea is stupid and offensive. If such ideas gained ground in ancient China when they were under attack from the Mongols (Genghis Khan et al), they would never have build the Great Wall and China as we know it would never have existed; it would've been eradicated by the Mongol tribes and other invaders. Free movement is too often imbalanced and just doesn't work whatever way you look at it.

Some immigration can benefit the UK, but the amount of immigration into the country is getting silly. Its not sustainable nor is it helpful. Its great for greedy bastards, corrupt landlords and dodgy employers, who can exploit these people, but its not great for the country. Plus, we cannot say anything to immigrants from Pakistan, India, the Caucases, China, etc. if we're continuing to let in migrants from the European Union come here unchallenged. Otherwise we'd be accused of discrimination. So fair's fair I say, let's limit all immigration and withdraw from this one-sided, unequal agreement. Besides which, the UK isn't anywhere near as wealthy as a lot of people think. Some of the towns in the Midlands and north, and even some London suburbs, are very deprived with high levels of unemployment, crime and violence. The grass is not always greener on the other side.

If we want to help out the world there're better ways to do it. How about the super-rich start paying their damn taxes which we could use to fund projects in the 3rd World? They hardly pay any tax as it is whilst we workers are expected to pay a damn fortune in taxation! Its about time they coughed up their fair share, the greedy bastards