Gay Marriage

[SilentFilm1988]

I'm sure this topic has been discussed on here before, but I just wanted to give my thoughts on it. What I like about this site is people from all over the world post on here, so what I'm about to write I can only say about gay marriage in the United States, I have no idea what the subject is like in other countries if it's allowed at all.

Anyway, in the United States for years we've been fighting for rights and equality, and gay marriage is just one of the things we've been fighting for. It's now become legal in my state Maryland for about a year now. So it was one time last year when I went out to this gay bar. This guy who was married started hitting on me, point blank asking me to come home with him and his husband (who was actually at the bar and about 5 feet away from him) and fuck them. I told the guy off and immediately left the bar. Now granted granted this guy was drunk, but I sincerly believe he would have done the same thing if he were sober. That that was there plan for the night to find somebody to take home with them.

I have this gay friend name Jean and he's told me stories of this gay guy he knows who's married but he said its purely a "business arrangement". That the gay guy he knows has repeadly asked him for sex and he's told him no more than once stating to his friend that he's married, and he's told my friend he doesn't see what the issue is.

Now I admit I am a bit of a prude myself, but what happened to me and what's happened to my friend honestly makes me sick and want to throw up. I realize we've come so far with accepting homosexuality as a whole which is great, but there is still homophobia out there. I feel these 2 examples are what give homosexuals a bad name. It just baffles my mind that some men are just throwing away something we've been fighting for decades to achieve. What is the point of having gay marriage if this is what it's going to be used for?

Sorry for the long tirade, just wanted to vent my feelings on the subject, anyone else feel similar about the topic?

[East]

Well...it all depends on how you define marriage and what you want from it. For me it is about equality under the law...period...and having said that...straight people get married for a variety of reasons that may or may not include love. A lot of people marry for money...or power...or business...or mutual benefits...or....and I see no problem with any of those reasons....

...and swinging is primarily a straight sport and a lot of straight married couples engage in it. Also...take a look at the statistics on infidelity from straight married men and women.,..they are STAGGERING....

Gay men are more open about it all because we never had to pretend that we were going to love honor and cherish anyone....

Just give us enough time and we will become as full of shit as so many of them are.

If it helps...the guy you were talking to didn't pretend he wasn't married...try finding a straight married guy who will do the same.

I don't think gay men can give a bad name to marriage even if they tried. Who wants to marry a midget did that already....so does the Real Housewives and so many other exploitation shows that have all straight people in them. They have made a mockery out of traditional marriage already....completely....

In the end...you need to define your own marriage on your terms and not really worry about what other people do...or how they define marriage. Easier said than done though.....

... I need to get married myself....for legal reasons.... and to make sure out assets are protected. The institution of marriage though is frightening for me...because of what I have seen straight people do with it. They have given me a lot of bad examples and now I equate marriage with death...and lies. Gay people didn't contribute at all to that idea that is firmly planted in my brain.

[Rareboy]

I can't believe you are 26.

Just because you live in the US...it doesn't mean you have to live in a bubble. To find out about homo marriage around the world:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Same-sex_marriage

Now, to your point about a married couple wanting to have a three way and some guy in an open marriage who wants to fuck your friend.

East has put it very well.

You do know, don't you, that this happens all the time among hetero couples too?????

As far as I can tell, it hasn't resulted in a huge backlash against heteros.

Relax. There are many homos....many not even married...who have happily spent their lives with one partner.

So stop clutching your pearls and worrying about whether the homos will destroy civilization and enjoy the ride. Maybe next time...take the couple up on the invite. You might learn something about the nature of their relationship.

[jimcrackcorn]

A marriage certificate doesn't necessarily mean monogamy for all who inter into a marriage contract.. As East & Rareboy have pointed out - even straight marriages are fraught with sexual exploits that go beyond monogamy.

Most of us have been brought up with the idea that marriage and monogamy are linked together and society expects us to conform to those rules. Well,,, that just doesn't happen in reality,,, and it never did.

Gay marriage isn't establishing a new set of rules here,, where we are more monogamous than our straight counterparts. We are just being more honest about what takes place in our relationships.

There are many of us who have maintained a monogamous marriage throughout the years. And there are many of us who have made a mistake or two along the way (cheating) while trying to have a monogamous relationship. There are also many marriages where the couple has decided to open up the relationship to include other bed partners. None of these relationships are bad,,, provided the couples have jointly agreed to what they want and expect from the relationship.

So,,, don't be disheartened when you see some married gay men playing around. It doesn't reflect as badly as it may seem when you take into account what has been secretly (and not so secretly) going on in straight marriages since the beginning of time.

Sincerely,
Jim

[SilentFilm1988]

So stop clutching your pearls and worrying about whether the homos will destroy civilization and enjoy the ride. Maybe next time...take the couple up on the invite. You might learn something about the nature of their relationship.

Okay answer me this. This is not just marriage this is open relationships to off men who aren't married. This is something I've pondered. Okay so say you get offered to have sex with someone who's taken, married or in a regular relationship regardless. So they get something out of it, but what would you personally get of it? I don't ever want to be the "other woman" or the home wrecker. I wouldn't see what id get out of that situation other than being a cheap whore.

[Lexington]

Okay answer me this. This is not just marriage this is open relationships to off men who aren't married. This is something I've pondered. Okay so say you get offered to have sex with someone who's taken, married or in a regular relationship regardless. So they get something out of it, but what would you personally get of it?

Sex.

You seem to be looking at sex simply as "the expression of love between two committed partners". And yeah, that sex is awesome, no question. But I've also had sex with guys I like but I'm not interested in getting into a relationship with. Guys I just want to get the sheets sweaty with. And that sex is awesome, too.

Is it inferior to "relationship sex"? Some might say so, but I just think it's different. Different dynamic, different components. It's inferior only if you've decided that "expression-of-love sex" is the ideal. Just like if you've decided nothing is better than a steak dinner, nothing else is going to be as good. But I've had some awesome chicken, shrimp and vegetarian dinners in my day.

Mind you, I think everything should be aboveboard. I'm totally fine with people in relationships having sex outside the relationship, but it should be agreed to, under whatever stipulations they both decide on. If they don't want to know anything about the other person, if they demand "not on my bed" or even "I want to watch video of the encounter" - that should be adhered to.

Lex

[Rareboy]

So stop clutching your pearls and worrying about whether the homos will destroy civilization and enjoy the ride. Maybe next time...take the couple up on the invite. You might learn something about the nature of their relationship.

Okay answer me this. This is not just marriage this is open relationships to off men who aren't married. This is something I've pondered. Okay so say you get offered to have sex with someone who's taken, married or in a regular relationship regardless. So they get something out of it, but what would you personally get of it? I don't ever want to be the "other woman" or the home wrecker. I wouldn't see what id get out of that situation other than being a cheap whore.

To begin with...you won't be the 'other woman' since you are male....but put that aside for the moment. No one is counseling you to help someone cheat. Or to play a cheap whore. But this isn't about you and what you do in bed.

You've brought two examples of married men who you are afraid are going to fan the flames of homophobia because of their wanton sexual mores. In the first instance, it was all above board...the couple just wanted a third for some recreational sex. You didn't want to. Instead of telling them to fuck off...you might have just said 'Sorry, not my scene'.
They don't need your moralizing.

In the second instance your friend is being propositioned by some guy who considers his marriage a business arrangement. And maybe it is. God knows there are enough straight marriages that are. Again. Your friend declined.

I don't think that you know enough about the complexity of relationships and marriage to be able to sit so high on the white hobby horse you are riding.......it isn't up to you to define whose marriage is what...or to generalize and think that all homo marriages are no different than the two you refer to. Not everyone is looking for sex outside their relationship. Some like sex but are not looking for emotional fulfillment or love outside their relationship.

I hope that you are lucky enough one day to find the one and only for you and to get married and live a long and healthy and happy life together.

But I think you might want to flick that judgmental angel off your shoulder and relax a bit, because I'm not seeing that years of homo marriage in Canada where I live has eroded the integrity and moral fibre of the nation....even though I suspect that the amount of philandering and marriage breakdown is likely in direct proportion to the heteros. And no one is writing tracts about how horrible the homos are because somehow we don't honour the institution of matrimony in the same sacred way that hetero people do.

[Lexington]

RB's post reminds me of some further comments I was going to make.


I don't believe the "gay marriage" I think most of us are fighting for is "public recognition of our monogamous status". It's simply "public recognition of our ongoing relationship". Wedding vows traditionally haven't included vows of monogamy. They include promises to be "true", but to me, that simply means a promise to be honest and open with your partner. And that ties in with the "keeping everything aboveboard" like I mentioned in my previous post.

If I sneak out from my house to meet a guy to hold hands, and nothing else, I'm cheating on him. Because I'm doing it behind his back, without his consent.

If I go out and have sex with another guy - hell, if I have sex with him on my bed while my partner's there - as long as he knows about it, and is cool about it, I'm not cheating on him.

Many people equate marriage with monogamy. And there's nothing wrong with married couples deciding to remain monogamous if that's what they both want. But it shouldn't be a requirement simply because "other people are going to expect us to be monogamous". Two of my (straight) married couple friends have open relationships, and those are just the two I know about. I'm assuming more of my married friends have open relationships, and simply don't talk about it with me - that's fine, I don't talk about my sex life with them much, either.

And I think it's a positive thing that people start thinking that marriage doesn't HAVE to equal monogamy. (You might not like it, but frankly, so what. I'm not into basement dungeons, but that doesn't mean I think people who have them need to rip them out.) Several decades ago, marriage also meant that the woman would immediately quit her job and start her "true" role has a housewife. This mindset was so prevalent that when my grandmother married my grandfather, they decided to keep the marriage a secret so she could continue working the job they loved. Easier to explain "oh we're not married yet" than to say "well, she really loves her job". It sounds silly now, but that was the mindset then. Hopefully, we'll continue opening our minds up as to what "marriage" really HAS to encompass.

Lex

[LJay]

Please Note carefully: Ozzie and Harriet was a fantasy. June and Ward Cleaver were only characters in a TV show.

That is all.

[East]

I just wanted to add one thing.....

The only marriages I ever saw were heterosexual ones and though enough of them scared me...I saw alot of great marriages as well....

...and this will probably be the same with gay marriages in years to come...proportionately as Rareboy stated....so it is best to make your marriage what you need or want it to be and let other people do the same....you will have a much more pleasant journey ahead if you can find a way to do that.....

I am still waiting for the day when we can refer to it as just MARRIAGE instead of hetero/homo/straight/gay marriage. When there is equality under the law...it is all the same anyway.