How to come to terms with the terms of your life

[pellaz]

... dear old DAD. I don't blame him, but he wasn't really THERE for me

you can blame your dad but don't complete the abuse cycle. acknowledge the hurt and be the positive person you seem to want to be.

I don't know why I'm gay....god is a HORRIBLE, HORRIBLE thing, to do this to me....I could've made a wife, and children happy....I don't want to be barren, and not have any kids....they're my life, my future....I believe VERY strongly in procreation....passing on the seeds

-you know god had nothing to do with you being gay.
-a gay man in a straight relationship is living a lie. he is worthless for his wife and the house has to be toxic for the children.
-in the right situation there is no reason why you shouldn't be able to have children in an open gay relationship. i just don't think your there just yet. get your live in order than start your family.
-there is nothing wrong with being gay, it is just not the prevalent sexual orientation.
-given there is maybe 3-5% gay in the population there are not eligible guys just waiting in line, just dont settle for someone you dont want.

gay straight or bi relationships are all the same. i think you need to get your life in order first so you can love your self. relationships start there.

[OsirisGuy23]

PA, thank you! Really, I'm very grateful for all the help you've all supplied me in seeking further help through counseling....

I no longer blame my father for what he failed to receive himself; in fact, to blame him would only perpetuate the hate/abuse spiral; someone has to make the sacrifice; I knew this upon meeting him, and reflect on this as if it were a mantra daily. I just don't understand why these feelings emerged, and why I had to be gay to do it? I have ALL the paternal instincts I think, but unfortunately I have a preference for men...I always figured that homosexuality would ensure me a life of misery, and loneliness because I figured that the majority of gay men (like most heterosexuals) where father-starved, sex hungry drug addicts trying to cope with the holes they felt in their hearts...I know that isn't true as a general rule, but I lack confidence in my judgement....I feel that SOMEHOW I'll meet a guy and he'll be just like my father....or he'll be spineless, and I despise cowardice, and a lack of inner valor....

But turning to my father, I don't particularly value the man's opinions on anything, he's not exactly an enlightened mind; he tends to meander through life bumping into one situation after the other; he's an incompetent moron, who in all personal honesty is beneath me, and I cannot find any value in him at all, which is why it so easy to not care for him ill or fair, so I don't really care how the situation pans out from there; I don't want him apart of my life, so I don't CARE to come out to him or my mother; they did their jobs; I survived to adulthood, and now I have to procreate, and that's on me. I own my responsibility, and I'm proud to do this. Somehow the image of "Boy meets Girl" is internalized in my psyche, so now that I SUPPOSE I prefer the "Boy meets Boy" scenario, it only makes me feel bad...

I hate the feeling/thoughts of knowing that everyone "sees through me" and sees I'm "gay"...it makes me feel less than a man...I'm trying SO hard to do what is RIGHT. I want to make my self happy, and my children....I'm not too concerned about a partner/relationship anymore, because I feel I have the strength to tackle all these endeavors alone, and in doing that, why would I need another person, if I'm more than able to handle it alone? And besides that, PARTNERSHIP is a flighty thing that most people know nothing about; who knows if that guy will be there tomorrow, get bored, or will develop the sudden urge to flee? Not all men have that paternal instinct, and that is a fear, that inhibits me from having any relationship with a male, and only increases my fear of loneliness with pursuing things with a male.

I can't explain WHY the urge to have children is so strong in me, but I HAVE to pass on what I know/feel/believe/desire to my children so they may take part in shaping a better tomorrow....at heart I'm only trying to make the world a better place, but I know that I have to make a PRACTICAL attempt at that; rearing children is a way to spread my ideals throughout the world...I want my children to go out into the world, and inspire, and influence other people for the better.

I have nothing but the best intentions at heart, but somehow, I try, I fight, to reconcile these feelings, and yet....If I look at a guy there it is....the "truth" standing up right between my legs...I just don't know...but I'm glad that you all are more experienced/patient with this....I have no one, NO ONE to turn to on this...

[oldster]

i am an older guy and take offence that we older guys are takeing atvantage
of the younger guys i had a 34 year relation ship with my ex and i dould happly die to make him happy just as long as it would make him happy i was willing to pay the price met him at age 16 but he had id for 18
i will agree there are lots but a blanket statement that we just take avantage of them is just wrong

[zeon]

Hello,
May i offer deepest sympathy for your dads abuse he has given as a child... I can only share personal experiences on parts... My father was and is like your dad in a way... Not being there as a child and you cannot blame yourself for him not being there... When we are young we think we are the reason our mum or dad walked out when infact we arent because we didnt force them out they "chose" to go willingly... Some men are nothing more than walking talking sperm banks producing babies and walking out on them and their mothers... These men i like to call animals because this is what animals do as part of natures course...
You have a mental block implemented inside which is whats causing you to feel uneasy at times with men.. Your worried inside that if something goes wrong this could have a effect which would cause them to yell at you and hey presto the man your shagging is reminding you of your dad in a way.. When i was 2 a friend of my fathers moved in and he was from northern england and he beat me on daily basis as he was a violent alcoholic and i had a fear of northern people because of the accent and they reminded me of him until i was much older and managed to associate that the northerness doesnt mean his an abuser... It is good to hear that you enjoy being a boy and your mascuninity because that is something your comfortable i.
Now you stated that he said if your gay he will disown you... Dont get worried over that because that is his problem not yours.. You are what you are and unique in your own way like everyone on here is unique in his or her own way.. Your father isnt a man and never will be... Sorry to say that but its true.. Anyone who brings a child into the world brings that child in with the up most conditional love... We and You didnt wake up one day and go Oh im gay shit help and go mad about it.. Hetrosexual men get worried about gay men because of something that has happenned in their life and to be honest you may never get to hear about this. You stated you had to endure abuse from him so why not just put him out of his misery and say dad im gay get over it or piss off??? Dont tell me your leaving just do it if your going to do it door is there walk on out but i will warn you if you do walk out your NEVER walking back in. I am what I am you are what you are and i cannot emotionally physically or sexually change how i am just because in your head its "bad"
The reason this is bothering you is because you didnt expect it happenning id imagen where he states nasty things but dont loose sleep over it as stated before its his problem not yours.. Going and resorting to older men by that decade can be a sign of low self esteem... Of course if your general preferance is older guys then by all means carry on i wont condemn that but i remember when i was unemployed and went on the game earning £40 for a five minute wank i felt like i was abusing myself worse than any abuse that had occured throughout my life and didnt realise this until a while into it because it took for ME to break my own cycle and you need to do it with you... Why not work on charismatic skills and look for someone who is around your age who you can have some fun with.. ?
Supressing your feelings would only lead to you feeling unhappy in yourself and you shouldnt be unhappy... Your the way you are ment to be and nature cannot be beaten or destroyed as nature will eventually destroy us all and wins every time. Men treat any guys like a dildo at times because men think with their dicks and this explains why men are more likely to cheat than a woman.

What you should do is sit down alone and just write down things that are bothering and effecting you in life and allow yourself to be free... Dont keep the inner you trapped in a prison because it will only make you feel shitty set yourself free from this pain and find a way to firstly accept yourself and then allow things to fall into place. If you dont things only get worse for you emotionally because your denying yourself urges your intitled to.

On a final note one thing that may help is remember you are:

You first gay second!

Kindest regards

zeon xx

[Bowyn Aerrow]

Osiris,

Intellectually you don't blame dad. Emotionally you do. THAT is why its still an issue that you feel a need to talk about.

My parents were/are 'unwell people'. Meaning they had their own issues and 'took it out' on me... I was abused in every way... yes every way.

Like you I reached an intellectual 'agreement' that no I don't hate my parents, I don't blame my parents, Its not daddy's fault... blah. That is the easy part. The hard part is getting your emotional side to actually agree with your thoughts.

Most abused people who say 'I have dealt with the abuse' have a strong belief, even a strong desire for this to be true, the reality is that unless they went through years of counseling, and have actually addressed the emotions and have found some sort of closure, they haven't really 'dealt with' the abuse.

Even then, many of us will not fully recover. That depends largely on how bad the abuse was. Personally, while I have a few years of therapy in me, and have by and large dealt with many of the emotions stemming from my childhood, I still have 'emotional baggage' that affects many aspects of my life.

Recovery is an ongoing process - it is never really finished... well until you're lying in the casket.

To one point or another all humans seek their parents in potential mates. Part of that is because we are 'programmed' from birth to idealize our parents who nurture, protect, feed, cloth us. Yes even those of us where neglected, beaten, tied up and locked in closets - all of that nasty stuff, where 'nurtured' to one degree or another - as sick as that may be.

Another aspect to this is that children have a strong dependance on their parent(s) for their well being. This doesn't mean we all are protected and provided for, we still depend on that parent.

Thus our first template of the perfect mate will reflect one parent or both of the parents. Thus there is a goodly amount of truth that straight men end up marrying mom, and that gay men end up marrying dad.

This is why so many children who were abuse end up with a domestic partner. While the person usually doesn't consciously pick the abusive partner, they do see aspects of dad (or mom however the case may be) in their prospective partner, thus always seem to be falling into the same sort of bad relationship. Abuse is not an isolated behavior, it is part of a much wider set of behaviors and patterns that most of us can't see.

You love hate attraction to older men is in part driven by that template you have inside of you, that template by which you measure all men by. And like nearly all of us, you are attracted to the many bits and pieces of the total character that reflects poorly in the men you meet.

The psychology of the whole thing is far more complex than that. We are not just flat 2 dimensional beings, we are more or less onions, each time you peel back a layer there is yet one more layer to be peeled back.

[Bowyn Aerrow]

Homosexuality and babies:

I want babies, lots of babies, a need to nurture, raise, protect... blah blah blah. That does not mean you are straight. It only means you are a human being who, like the majority of us, have a very real need to procreate.

Gays having a stronger attachment/desire to be a parent may be an adaptive response that our modern society hates to even think about.

There has been much debate about the evolutionary purpose of gays and lesbians. We are seen as evolutionary 'dead ends' because we do not procreate due to our attraction to the same gender. Yet here we are, still being born in proportion to the rest of the world.

Most anti-gay people refuse to admit that gays are being born to straight people. They act like the 'gay gene' is passed down from generation to generation as if its blue eyes or some other recessive trait. but that doesn't hold water when we consider that gays rarely reproduce. If it was a recessive trait, homosexuals would not exist today.

More and more studies are clearly showing a link between the birth of gay men to be linked to the fertility of mom. A fertile mom would produce more infants, thus over coming infant mortality rates and hedge her bets on the survival of her genetic material. In many of these studies, gay males are born later in her child producing years.

Evolution does not like 'useless' individuals. Thus Evolution will not only produce something from one thing, to insure a species survives, but will also adapt and promote traits in that extra strain that also helps the species.

There is some (to a lot, depending on who you read) evidence to suggest that before humans settled, the roll of the gay male was to be more of a 'nanny' in the tribe. more adults to tend the young, to hunt and gather means that the young have a much greater chance of survival.

Survival of our species didn't hinge solely on our ability to have lots of babies, it also hinged on our ability to get enough food and form working social communities were some would be willing to not compete in the gene pool, thus the production of infants remained at a sustainable level to the ecology and number of working adults.

In modern times we see that many gays are more in touch with their 'sensitive' side. Many are naturally drawn to caring for and nurturing children. Children at the same time are comfortable with gay males, relating to them more and able to form a fast, strong parental like bond. Many gay males are drawn to teaching, and make some of the best teachers to the youth, more so than 'straight' people.

This is why we are finding long term studies of gay foster parents having a predominately huge positive effect on the children, more so than mere 'biological' straight parents.

Thus your strong desire to be a parent may point more at your being a homosexual than a heterosexual.