Friend was very flirty, I gained feelings, got rejected, confused

[heythere999]

Honestly guys, I'm not crazy, am I? Like honestly when I look back at everything there's no way straight people would act this way. And him "not knowing" or saying it "as a joke"... what straight guy hugs another guy and whispers "I wish I could just be in your arms forever"? Or says things like "why do you have a crush on me"? Or "why do we always have so much sexual tension"? Or the hand kisses and everything else he did? Always craving my attention?

He makes me feel like there's a possibility that it's all in my head... but I really don't think so. Especially since everyone else says or thinks otherwise (not just here).

The other day I came over to his house and he was being a little more touchy again. For example a song would play and he'd start tapping my shoulder, he'd give me random hugs, he'd stretch and yawn and then pull me to hug me, etc.

And then yesterday he was randomly cold towards me. He came to my house and I got him a chair and he said "thanks BROTHER" and then sat away from me. And then when we relocated and the only chair available was next to me, he looked around for like 10 seconds and then took the chair and sat next to other friends. I got pissed and he tried getting my attention back a little bit but I just remained annoyed.

At this point I've realized the problem isn't me at all, it's him. I've done everything I can. I've shown him that I care, and I put a lot of effort. And yet he still has the audacity to lie and deceive, and imply that everything is my fault.

This is what I want to send him:

"Dude, why do I get the feeling that our friendship is still shit? Why is it that no matter how much we talk and stuff that we still have this awkward tension? That it's still unstable? I'm gonna be honest and say I think this is just unfair at this point, to me.

Yeah I'm "difficult" and I know you mean it even though you say it in a joking manner. I know I am, but that's because I care, and way more than I should. I feel like you take what I say to heart sometimes still and I also think that you have some misconceptions about me as well, and I also think that you're holding things in. I can tell because you're colder most of the time and sometimes you show hostility. Which is stupid, because I've said a million times that you shouldn't take negative things I say to heart too much, that I'm honest with you because I care, and I don't hold things back and I tell you the truth. Honestly I have not witnessed anyone anywhere that has shown this much care towards a friend as much as I have towards you, ever. And you don't return jack shit to boot. You should be comfortable enough by now to say stuff on your mind but I feel like you aren't.

You're probably thinking everything about this friendship is my fault. And on a shallow level, it probably is. I'm the one with the mood swings and the one that randomly sends essays. But the more I think about it, the more I realize, it isn't. Who's the one who says everything on his mind, who puts the effort into actually fixing things, who's the one who is genuine 100% of the time... me. I put in so much effort into this friendship, way more than I should. And like I've said before the way I act with you is a product of how you treated me. You reap what you sow man have you heard of that expression? In the end I honestly can't put the blame on myself, especially now. I've shown how much I care and I've done my part. Every time I talk to you I hope we progress but we honestly... don't. Because if we did I wouldn't be doing this same "10-page essay" thing I've done a million times already in the past few months.

I'm not an idiot man I can tell you aren't being 100% genuine with me. You said trust is important. That you need to know that I have your back. I give you every reason to trust me. Yeah I've talked shit about you but you know 100% the reason why and I've been honest about it. Other than that I've opened up to you so much and I've communicated with you and I've shown you and told you I only do the things that I do because I care so much. Meaning that if you treat me right I will be the most trustworthy person on this goddamn planet. You? Well for one I knew before we got close that you're known for being a liar but you can't bring up the "judgmental" card because clearly I gave you a chance (and also (former friend), whom I heard nothing but terrible things about before I met him). And now that I've given the chance, honestly how do you expect me to believe the things you say when you can't even admit to things like knowing that (close girl friend in group) liked you when you hooked up? You can't even tell the truth when you're supposedly opening up to me. Instead you have to make up lies like with the (store) thing I keep bringing up where you said "I was thinking strictly in (organization's) terms I swear." Come on man have a little more respect for me. When I'm practically begging you to be honest with me I think I deserve honesty. I'm not a moron. We both know that is complete bullshit. I don't get what is so hard to admit. There's no possibility other than you feeling that you had power over me and you wanted to take advantage of it. When the truth is painfully obvious I'll respect you more and trust your words more if you just own up to it rather than coming up with a lie that not even a 4-year-old would believe.

And speaking of respect, can you please stop bringing up (girl he liked) to me? If you claim the way I feel about you is not a problem, then this is something that has to be compromised. It was enough choosing ME to be your messenger out of every possible candidate, but now you have to make a "joke" out of it or constantly bring it up? Either you're trying to get a reaction out of me or you're really bad at noticing when I get annoyed. When have I ever laughed or shown a semblance of joy when you mention (girl he liked) for you to keep bringing her up and saying the same goddamn shit is beyond me. And also please stop asking me if it's "alright with you" if you hang out with a girl, or if a girl will "go for a guy like me," you've done this like 4 times and I'm convinced you say it to get an ego boost.

And to be honest I have absolutely no clue why you claim I'm judgmental towards you. Or towards people in general. Like you've pointed out I know you so well, I know so much about you, you've hurt me so much and you continue to do so, and I still choose to stick around. I don't "judge" your character. If I was a judgmental asshole like you think I am, I would have dropped you months ago knowing everything. Hell I wouldn't have even given you the chance to be friends with you. And I know you think I am a judgmental asshole because when I say something slightly harsh to anyone or if I correct someone you get very defensive. Like when (close friend) told us that he had a 63% in his History class and I said "come on (close friend)" and you attacked me for that comment... I said that because I care about (close friend) and I want him to succeed in life. I don't want him to be happy with a low D. I want him to get somewhere that's why when I'm with him I tend to bring up school and when he's with me at (school) or that one time at my house I made him study and only study because I care. Not that I'm some asshole prick that thinks he's better than everyone else like you think I am. You may think that my judging is too "harsh," but I've shown multiple times now how that's simply not true. I judge, just like every other human being, but the fact that I give people chances despite what I hear or think before I know them well showcases that me judging "too harshly" is practically irrelevant or just flat-out not the case. For example, I dislike (former friend) not only because of the way he acted but because he tried to intentionally pit people against me. I think that is more than good enough of a reason to dislike someone.

And you've told me before that I don't appreciate you but that's total crap man and you know it. I feel like an idiot, you're the one that doesn't appreciate me. If you did anything you've done to me to anyone else they would have erased you from their lives months ago. I still willingly put up with all this. I actually show that I care about you and I want you to grow and live up to your potential. Sometimes I feel like the things I say go in one ear and out the other. When you thought I look down on you... Come on, really? How could you even think that, considering what you know? Yeah, I'm disappointed but that doesn't mean I look down on you; not at all.

And another thing I've noticed about you is that you screw up, and you just say that you didn't "mean to." Like again with (close girl friend in group), hooking up with her, high fiving the guys and then saying shit like "I did her a favor," and then claiming that you "didn't mean to"... Or throwing the lit stogs and saying you "didn't mean to"... Or acting the way you did and saying you "didn't mean to"... Dude how does that make it any better? Or make you look better? Or show me that you care for and have respect for the people that you're close to? Even if you didn't really "mean to" like you claimed, how does that make it better, the stuff that you do? If that's really the truth, you need to start taking responsibility for your actions and realize that the things you do can have major consequences even if you didn't "mean to." And this is why I sometimes associate the "lying to themselves" thing towards you. Sometimes I feel like you lie to yourself to make yourself feel better and not face the truth and you don't want to take responsibility for your actions. That, or, you are completely unaware of the consequences of your actions and that doesn't make it okay.

And you probably think lying is a good way to avoid bad situations but it actually stings you in the ass in the long run. Because look at the result here. I'll be honest here and say we had (well to me at least) an amazing friendship minus some bumps here and there but now it's completely fucked up and not just because of what I admitted. And it really depresses me how it can get to this. Shows that the perception I had of you was all wrong.

You claimed you got insulted when I said you don't respect me... Why would you feel insulted when I am simply pointing out to you that you consistently showcased obviously disrespectful behavior? Sure you had a reason behind it but it doesn't change the fact that it's disrespectful. It's the same thing here. You will probably feel insulted by everything I said but I am actually doing the right thing by telling you the truth and what's on my mind, and secondly, when you've hurt me so goddamn much and when you continue to lie and deceive and not put in effort man, what the hell do you expect. Everything I say makes sense. Every action I make, makes sense. I can't say the same for you. You claim I'm the one being difficult but in reality, from the core, the difficult one here is you."

Tonight or something

[unisus]

First off, stop feeling lowly about yourself. You're just in love with a flirt; he likes attention and toying with emotions. Stop writing him essays and overthinking things; he's your friend, not your lover. Stop feeling guilty. Stop overanalyzing details and driving yourself crazy; stop throwing tantrums when he annoys you or seems disinterested. You are obsessing and out of touch; it is what it is. Forced hope isn't truth. Fear isn't truth. Just love, live, and let be. You cannot make his choices nor judge them; if he wants to be with you, he will choose to be with you.

[heythere999]

Sorry, I had to reply on my phone yesterday so I was short. I'm on a laptop so let me see if I can go deeper.



Your relationship was fucked up from the start if this man thinks he is allowed to just hold your hand and make gay jokes at you, along with strange eye contact, intrusive comments on your sex life, and use women the way that he does. Sounds like you enjoyed some of the things that you did together, but rather than your relationship "taking a turn for the worse", it's actually taking a turn for the better in a way that you did not expect. Before, he was trespassing all over you, and you have evolved to such a degree that you courageously confronted him and now realize that he's been a real pervert. I'm not sure how the realization that one of your "best friends" is a pervert could go without tremendous upheaval.



His self-loathing is obnoxious if he isn't willing to listen to anyone's advice. You claim he's been hooking up with girls, making out with them, suggesting you do the same; he's been toying with your feelings. It isn't normal to make jokes about dating or being intimate with someone, regardless of a person's orientation. He's been implying it, stating it, suggesting it, making references to it, planting the thoughts and seeds, and invading you with thoughts that have absolutely nothing to do with being a respectable friend ... Of course you don't trust him, because there absolutely no use in this behavior. Thoughts and words have real power and feeling; I used to look for little hidden signals when I was your age too .. I hope you find the right person to hold you and build a life with, and that you realize you're worth more than teasing, obscure makeout sessions, and hooking up.



I hate lying; he's obviously immature ... Borderline emotionally retarded.



Why did you have a "girl for the night"? You need to figure out who you are; quit living in the closet, if you are, and find a real, respectable human-being. It's tough in today's world, especially in Capitalistic societies built on the degradation and separation of love for the power-elite ... But it will at least make you feel good about your decisions, and yourself. The more you objectify romance, the more you'll sulk and destroy your own dignity and others. You're worth more than that.



I feel nauseous; the secrecy, the fornication, the nonchalant trivialization of it all—and even sadder, your romantic obsession with people who participate in this behavior. Protect your heart.



He sounds like he's been a real piece of garbage.



It may also be her way of handling her own rejection. Maybe she was honest.



When you say "hooked up" with, do you mean sex? I was under the impression you meant sex. Anyway ...



He may have some superficially attractive qualities, but if he's affecting your self-esteem, you need to take a step back before you begin trying to emulate this. Just because some groups turn people into piranhas, does not make it humane ... Humanity is bigger than society.

For some reason, I did not see this until now. Thank you so much.

But honestly at this point I don't know what to do. If I ever have another talk with him I'll have to be not blunt and call him out on his lies, that's pretty much the only way anything will change with the method I've been using this far.

[PartyPal]

.This, unfortunately, must be quite a common situation for young gay guys to find themselves in during high school: I experienced a very similar thing with a guy when I was 17/18 and it was absolutely soul destroying.

This guy was doing the same things as yours - touching me affectionately, sitting on my lap, playing footsie with me when we'd watch movies (often in front of our other friends), hand holding , telling me that he loved me, that I was special, sleeping in the same bed as me etc...

I came out to him, letting him know I was confused. I spoke to him in person about it and told it to him straight (no pun intended...). I told him I was gay, asked him how he felt about it, asked him was he interested in me (twice) - to which he replied very ambiguously (as seems to be the case with your guy). As the conversation came to a close I asked him not to flirt with me so much because it was confusing me - yet he continued to do it, in fact even more so!

I tore myself up about it day after day, to the point where I ended up in a poor mental state and failing in my studies for the first time in my life, and you know what came of it in the end? Absolutely nothing. I considered him to be my best friend at the time. But however I managed it, I summoned the little ounce of self respect I had left and cut him and all of our mutual friends out of my life because I knew that even though it was going to be difficult, it was best for me. I studied hard, I got an excellent job and eventually I found a man, an actual gay man who didn't want to play games with me (well, not those kinda games if you catch my drift uh huh, oooohhh yeah! ...)

That guy who I lusted after for two years, wondering is he or isn't he, whom I was sure was gay or at the very least bisexual? He's in a long term relationship with a drop dead gorgeous woman. He was playing with me the entire time - straight as an arrow.

Your guy has his reasons for keeping you close but they are more than likely not ones that concern you. You might be his way of practising romance for when he finds himself a girlfriend, maybe he likes the idea of having a trendy "bromance" (which believe it or not a lot of straight females seem to find an awfully appealing concept), maybe he's a compulsive liar and you're his long con - seemingly far fetched suggestions, I know but more than plausible if you consider the occasional strangeness and complexity of human nature.

I honestly don't think the guy is interested in you sexually. Think about it - if he's so comfortable holding you and touching you in public, and if he truly found you irresistible he would have most certainly already taken the plunge by now and given you a cheeky snog!

And by no means do I intend to sound offensive but those really long texts or monologues you're delivering to this guy? It shouldn't take that. It's not natural and it might be coming across as a bit obsessive, which he in turn is probably absolutely loving - I mean essentially you're continually pouring out this un-diluted adoration to him - to be on the receiving end of that from a sweet person, guy or girl - who wouldn't find that addictive? And you are providing him with that in abundance. He gives you enough back to keep you clinging on. He's dodging "the talk" because he wants to hear you pouring that out to him again.

Maybe I'm wrong here, maybe your case is totally different, this is only my opinion and it's coming from advice the guys on this very website gave me many years ago which I'm now so thankful I took... but for me, whether he was gay or not, at this stage I would feel like I would have to take the high road and look out for number one - get yourself back on track with your studies, put relationships on the back burner until you get yourself sorted out and enjoy living for yourself. Even if he is gay and comes out to you, you'll be presented with even more mind boggling questions - why did he take so long to tell you when he knew you'd be comfortable with it? Why did he continue to put you through such prolonged heartache? Is it all worth it?

There's much more to life than finding a special guy - for now, find something else you love, embrace and excel at it! When you've healed, get back in the game!

Hope it all works out man you seem like a good guy.