Worst things about being gay ...

[Shadow]

Wow ... a number of interesting points raised, and all whilst I was merrily off in the land of nod !!

Dan, whilst I'm sure Michael can (and will) speak on his own behalf, he's not a racist, so yeah - I think you perhaps misinterpreted the thrust of his point, which was just that it really doesn't matter whether your child has two same-gender parents or two different-gender parents, the odds are, he/she is going to get teased at school for SOMETHING, so this is just as likely a target as anything else.

FutureRD, I do hope I didn't come across as suggesting I wouldn't love an adopted child as much as if it were my own flesh and blood - I was aiming for explaining that, to me, having my own child by my partner would be bliss, as it would be a continuation of our respective family lines, and represent an act of total love between us, and that can't be a bad thing. PLUS of course we would be able to watch the child grow, and exhibit some of my characteristics, and some of his ... which would be reward after reward (the good and the bad bits).

To round off, I would rather have a child and stand by its side through all the ups and downs life has to offer, helping it to grow, develop, and appreciate that there IS good and bad in the world, but that it's a wonderful gift to have the chance to live in it and to find its own way through life, than to rule out the possibility of having a child because the score in the potentially negative column was so great as to sway my opinion ...

I'm not saying there's anything wrong with not wanting kids - far from it - it's all a personal preference at the end of the day ... but that's my personal take on it, for myself.

Cheers guys mile:.

!?!?! Shadow !?!?!

[tombishop]

ok you've all gone down the offspring line BUT i reckon one of the worst things about being gay is the conservatism.

we all enjoy this sudden feeling of liberty when we come out

but then so many of us give in to peer pressure to be beefed up, in fashion & having our brains constantly banged out that it just undermines the whole thing

(I do enjoy getting my brains banged out but that's incidental)

the best thing about coming out is that it makes you assert yourself. so why do so many of us just step back in line soon after eh? :confused:

Tom

[Shadow]

I think it's because "normality" (which is what we strive to attain by coming out) is effectively a steady, simple line ...

Coming out is like moving from below the line to above it, and seizing your destiny in the palm of your hand for just a moment ... but after you've done it, you naturally get drawn back TO the line ... the "normal" line, where it's just another part of you, and not the sum of what you are - it's just another facet of the greater you ...

It saddens me that we are forced to classify ourselves in the modern world - why we are cast into a group based on our sexual preference - what's the need ?

*runs to the window and throws himself out*

*realises he's on the ground floor*

:redface:

!?!?! Shadow !?!?!

[tombishop]

ha ha ha - hope you didn't hurt yerself Shadow

i see your point. i guess it's just a shame that - as out gay blokes & lesbians - we all truly assert ourselves at some point, then most of us just slip back into towing the line.

we all know gay bars and clubs where everyone tries real hard to look the same. surely we're not all that eager just to fit in?

(having said this i do realise i'm wearing a shirt & tie on my avatar - it was for an interview, honest!)

[Shadow]

Ha ha, bless !!!!!

No, don't get me wrong, I do agree with what you're saying, but I think there's a distinction between fitting in, and wanting to fit in ... when we're closeted we want to fit in - I can't think of anybody that I've spoken to who's closeted who doesn't just want to be loved as they naturally are, without having to keep up the pretence of being what they perceive as "normal" (i.e. not the way they are at that point in their own eyes), but once you've come out, as you said, you've exhibited the raw courage and BALLS to do one of the bravest things you will ever have to do in life - to ask to be loved and accepted simply for being you ...

... and then yeah - the slide back down the slope, but by that point I think we've matured from wanting to fit in, to actually fitting in, because people can take what they consider to be this new information, and incorporate it into their understanding of you as a person, which ultimately revises the normality of the situation, and brings back stability ...

... it's like a pond - coming out is like dropping a grand piano into the otherwise still pond, but if you let it, the ripples will calm down and the pond will become still again, with the grand piano sitting neatly in with whatever else lies beneath the surface ...

!?!?! Shadow !?!?!

[Michael]

Someone ranted at me and I missed it?

*Note to Forum: Michael has a thousand opinions and has no problem expressing them and rarely ever takes offense at anything said to him*

Not that I won't debate tooth and nail if I believe I'm right (or perhaps just for the fun of it because I can be a shit disturber)....but I always consider it a discussion and not taken personaly.

All I ask is that you take the time to read and understand what I have said and disagree with me on it's merrits, not on misunderstanding.

What were we talking about? .........

[Shadow]

'twas nothing mile:.

!?!?! Shadow !?!?!

[Dan1089]

Good answer! mile: Michael,I got ugly for no particular reason (guess I drank decaf) Either way,I was out of line & should have taken out time to properly take in a comment you had made.Doesn't matter now.

[Michael]

Well I appreciate you standing up and saying so. Few people manage that.

But like I said, I'm thick skinned....Now if you want to debate, :-) Shadow will tell you, I loooooove a good wrestle. Just be prepared to get pinned to the matt :o

Decaf would make anyone loopy..........

[Shadow]

Ah, but do you enjoy the wrestling more than the people that wrestle with you ??? .

!?!?! Shadow !?!?!