Ekwarph Wrote:If I remind correctly, in Paris there often is some "Amnesty international" like associations (don't remember exactly) to make people aware about what happens in the world.
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I must admit I'm a bit surprized to read such knee-jerk reactions on this topic. People should go to a gay pride, just to see, and then make their opinion.
Thanks for your post, Ekwarph, but this was not the Paris or Geneva Pride.... it was Norwich, which was just too too sedate... but fun. I understood why my British partner thought it needed more of an edge to it, politically speaking... Amnesty International would have been a good association to see in this local pride.
princealbertofb Wrote:Thanks for your post, Ekwarph, but this was not the Paris or Geneva Pride.... it was Norwich, which was just too too sedate... but fun. I understood why my British partner thought it needed more of an edge to it, politically speaking... Amnesty International would have been a good association to see in this local pride.
I understood
I just wanted to defend the importance of gay prides.
but I bet in lots of capitals it must be as great as in Paris or in Geneva.
But there's a problem : to have an association in the pride, you must have the association in the city. And to have the association in the city, you must have lots of people concerned by the association, and for that you need lots of inhabitants, so your small town has to be a big city. :p
I think the fact that there was "not enough" for this pride is not to blame, Obviously in the London pride at 150 km from there you would have that kind of association, so far!
BYoNexus Wrote:I see no problem with gay pride parades. They may be a bit over the top for me, personally, but I remember when I was just coming out, and still very unsure of myself and vulnerable, making plans to go downtown on the day of the parade to see what it was about. I didn't so much look at the parade itself, as the hundreds of people of all ages lining the streets cheering for the people in the parade. That was something I will hold dear for the rest of my life, most likely. This helped my sense of pride in myself, but you'll never catch me in my underwear in the parade.
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Anyone who thinks the scantily clad people in the parades are what make a gay person are just ignorant, and never seek to actually learn anything at all about us. Some might be like that, and more power to them. It does not mean, by any stretch, that that particular part of the parade speaks for all the LGBT community.
Something in what BYOnexus said here, that reminds me too, that before Prides existed (yes, I've lived that long) here.... we would find out whichever way we could what it meant to live a gay life, to be gay. For me it would have been going to any film that had a gay theme or had a gay character. I needed to know what it was about. There were no prides to feel proud about being gay, nor to see what other gays looked like. All our knowledge seemed encyclopaedic.
Before and later than that, I'd be looking for things in magazine articles, in books, in encyclopaedias etc... and not finding much porn because it (and the Internet) was just unavailable.
I suppose we have the right, now, some 35-40 years later to relish in the fact that gay men and lesbians can walk down the streets with their children and families, proud and happy to be normal, but gay, when it was always so hush hush and taboo for such a long time. The AIDS epidemic in some way helped, but didn't help. So that was, for some, another setback. The AIDS epidemic surely brought gay lives and couples to the fore and gave the prides another edge. Today we should be totally indignant about homophobic laws that are making a comeback, like pestilent plagues on welfare.
All blacks are either lazy welfare moms, or they are drug pushing gang bangers.
How do we know? Because the few are help up as example of the whole group.
All homosexuals are sexual deviants , how do we know....
Like it or not, these people represent you. Every time a person hears that you are gay they know for a fact that you are like that ^^^ - all the time.
They know that you will indeed convert their kids, you will subject their innocent children to your perversion, and the homoSEXual Agenda.
They know that Pride is code for SEX. They also know that all of those nearly naked bodies are on drugs, or drunk and that they are barely restraining themselves from having an orgy in the middle of Hometown. This is what they see, and that is all they know of us and we are all birds of a feather, if a few of us do it, then it follows we all do it.
We ask for Equality then act nothing like equals.
Gay Pride is the second most popular 'argument point' that I go against in Gay Equality debates. It is really hard to tell people that the word is homosexual not homoSEXual and try to explain its not just about sex. Why is it hard, gee I know maybe because our SEX parades make it pretty clear what is on the minds of the LGBT all the time - SEX and only sex.
The primary one is Gay Promiscuity. They most popular question is how does that open relationship thing work with Gay Marriage since Marriage is by definition about monogamy.
Honestly I have no idea how to answer that one, and so many LGBT are all open and honest about 'open relationships' and its 'ok' which is totally against the thousands of years of what marriage means - um - monogamy....
How many members do we have come here TERRIFIED about coming out because their parents, their friends those people who they are hiding from see this as 'Gay Culture' and have formed strong opinions based on what they see? Where does the idea of Gay Culture come from? our Gay Pride Parades where sex is way up at the top of the agenda.
We claim we are 'normal' then we better start acting like 'normal' people and condemning those who act 'abnormal' as representatives of us.
If not for those of us who are out of the closet and apparently just don't give a fuck what people think about us, then for those of us who are hiding in a closet because they will receive the retribution of the actions of those 'few' who represent us to the whole world.
Why do Africans want to kills us? Because they see what we do in the "Free World" during our Gay Pride (SEX) Parades and they do not want to inflict that on their children.
We want respect, then we have to act respectably. We want to be seen as human being and not as 'butt buddies' then we need to tone down the sex aspect there. Failure to do so will only keep the shit pot stirring and sadly its innocent people, folk who would never do these sorts of antics that end up getting 'punished'.
BA, please...that's not intellectually honest to take a random image, you know that media will sell more papers if they shoot "shocking" images.
Maybe 90% of the people you meet in GP are normal...just like them :
The kind of deduction that is done with what you find on the internet :
Will you forbid every gay erotic or porn websites? Will you forbid people who have uncommon practices to actually practice? No! It's their private life...however, people can be stupid enough to say that it's a gay thing by seeing only one video.
Otherwise, for me, the pix you posted are not shocking, I mean, not more shocking than Rio carnaval for instance. So, why don't we say that allowing Rio Carnaval is something that tarnishes the images of Brazilians in the world?
If cultures had to change regarding to what other peoples think of them, there would be no difference between people. It's your right not to like it, but don't say it hurts more than it gives benefits to gay people.
This is so offensive on so many levels that it isn't even remotely funny.
you are 22 years old and you want to tell the rest of us that we are suffering 'internalised homophobia because we don't mince and ACT gay? REALLY
REALLY, what you have said is so damned offensive. You do not have the right to TELL other people how they should feel and how they should act when you have only been on this earth for a mere 22 years.
I couldn't give a fly fuck if you are a queen and act like a steroteypical gay, some of my friends fit in that category...how ever for me to be a stereotypical gay i WOULD have to ACT because this would be unnatural to me as I am being the person I am and with relative ease and absolutely NO ACTING.
You do not get the right to dictate how a gay man should act...you are disgusting and offensive for trying to do so.
there are only 2 words for you. Disillusioned, and Bitter. And here are several reasons why.
Not once did i push the idea that someone needs to behave in a stereotypical manner in order to fit into this community, nor will i respect someone solely because they behave in a stereotypical manner. I welcome anyone into this community as long as they. Disillusioned by your absolute bitterness.
Since you are incapable of deciphering the message in my post i'll spell it out a little more clearly.
Your (or anyone else's for that matter) Disdain for stereotypical behavior and it's portrayal in the media, will NEVER make you more "normal" in the eyes of a bigot or a homophobe. you are gay....that is the ONLY fucking reason a bigot or homophobe (Someone with an unfounded fear/hatred of GAYS) needs to hate you.
Anyone who says "i can't stand how my community is represented by stereotypes because they give gays on a larger scale a bad name." Is suffering from internalized homophobia. end of discussion that's just simply textbook internalized homophobia and anyone saying something like this sounds Bitter.
Clearly you have some issues if my post offended you because i said absolutely nothing offensive. And if you want to bring age into the equation...I'm appalled that someone who's "been on this earth" a whole 45 years is incapable of making a sound judgement after reading something because he wasn't able to comprehend the actual message.
TLR: Don't come for me because i definitely wasn't coming for you.
Re-posting this as it seems to have been lost in the moderation queue:
Erm, I'm not sure what kind of gay prides you people are attending. In my experience, most people are clothed normal individuals of society. Most people at Toronto parade just come to watch, and probably aren't even gay (No, it's not snowing here in summer, it gets to around 95 F).
Firstly: If you google image "gay pride," of course you're going to get the images the media chooses to take. That doesn't mean *everyone* is a nude hot guy! And yes, there are some crazies who may vandalise public property in the name of w/e (although I've never seen that happen here) - they have nothing to do with gay pride, you'll always get a few nutcases wherever you go. What pride really looks like:
Secondly: Gay pride is a celebration of sexuality and gender, and even among LGBT people, we express our sexuality and gender in different ways. Some people may feel prideful via nudity, and well, Shakespeare, this isn't the 18th century! If you (or your children) are offended by that, go home! You can enjoy the bakesale a month later.
Thirdly: Thanks @ the OP for not providing any information about "HOPE". Here's an interesting read for anyone who wants to start their day (or evening) feeling annoyed: http://theroadtoemmaus.org/RdLb/22SxSo/P...HOPE02.htm
Quote:When society allows men to marry men and women to marry women, it
perpetuates the alienation of the sexes and contributes to the ever-increasing
crisis in the sex roles. Before Stonewall, gays and lesbians mixed socially
and in the clubs with a pretty good understanding of and appreciation for
one another. But as gay liberation took hold, gay males, feeling ebullient
from their new-found freedom, descended into a bacchanalia of narcissism
and promiscuity. Segregated bars, orgy rooms and bathhouses exploded in
number and luxury. Strange parasitic diseases soon began appearing, and by
1981, a "gay cancer" was identified as AIDS. We must honestly admit that
even gay men's attempt to create a world without women failed catastrophically.
What as misogynistic ass. We mixed socially in back alleys without access to any kind of health care whilst society punished us. Readying that from this imbecile's article made me really f**king furious. If society had had more liberal attitudes on sex, sexuality and gender then we wouldn't be in this situation with AIDs in the first place. I wonder what this guy's opinion is about the AIDs crisis in Africa. Quickly become a crisis here in the "1st world" too.
Quote:Gay activists and their ever-willing accomplices in the media, relentlessly drive
through our skulls that homosexuality is "not a choice", because no one would
choose to be gay in a homophobic society. Firstly, there is an element of choice
in all behavior, sexual or otherwise. Secondly, despite public fanfare and trendy
hypotheses, there is no conclusive scientific evidence as to the biological, genetic,
psychological and sociological influences on sexual orientation. The modern change
in opinion concerning homosexuality, though presented as a scientific advance, is
contradicted rather than supported by science.
Bowyn Aerrow Wrote:All blacks are either lazy welfare moms, or they are drug pushing gang bangers.
How do we know? Because the few are help up as example of the whole group.
All homosexuals are sexual deviants , how do we know....
(had to remove photos because not at 50 posts)
Like it or not, these people represent you. Every time a person hears that you are gay they know for a fact that you are like that ^^^ - all the time.
They know that you will indeed convert their kids, you will subject their innocent children to your perversion, and the homoSEXual Agenda.
They know that Pride is code for SEX. They also know that all of those nearly naked bodies are on drugs, or drunk and that they are barely restraining themselves from having an orgy in the middle of Hometown. This is what they see, and that is all they know of us and we are all birds of a feather, if a few of us do it, then it follows we all do it.
We ask for Equality then act nothing like equals.
Gay Pride is the second most popular 'argument point' that I go against in Gay Equality debates. It is really hard to tell people that the word is homosexual not homoSEXual and try to explain its not just about sex. Why is it hard, gee I know maybe because our SEX parades make it pretty clear what is on the minds of the LGBT all the time - SEX and only sex.
The primary one is Gay Promiscuity. They most popular question is how does that open relationship thing work with Gay Marriage since Marriage is by definition about monogamy.
Honestly I have no idea how to answer that one, and so many LGBT are all open and honest about 'open relationships' and its 'ok' which is totally against the thousands of years of what marriage means - um - monogamy....
How many members do we have come here TERRIFIED about coming out because their parents, their friends those people who they are hiding from see this as 'Gay Culture' and have formed strong opinions based on what they see? Where does the idea of Gay Culture come from? our Gay Pride Parades where sex is way up at the top of the agenda.
We claim we are 'normal' then we better start acting like 'normal' people and condemning those who act 'abnormal' as representatives of us.
If not for those of us who are out of the closet and apparently just don't give a fuck what people think about us, then for those of us who are hiding in a closet because they will receive the retribution of the actions of those 'few' who represent us to the whole world.
Why do Africans want to kills us? Because they see what we do in the "Free World" during our Gay Pride (SEX) Parades and they do not want to inflict that on their children.
We want respect, then we have to act respectably. We want to be seen as human being and not as 'butt buddies' then we need to tone down the sex aspect there. Failure to do so will only keep the shit pot stirring and sadly its innocent people, folk who would never do these sorts of antics that end up getting 'punished'.
Absofuckinglutely NOT! just no.
The ideas in this post are so counterproductive to any type of gay rights movement.
First of all. Sex negativity to appease the Theocratic right (the people who gave the "africans" (or more aptly the Ugandans who were pushing for the "kill the gays" legislature) were missionaries from the U.S...i don't think they got the idea from seeing a man on a float wearing a thong/speedo/glitter/costume/etc.) will never get us anywhere. All sex negativity does is "teach" children abstinence (which winds up in young girls everywhere getting prego)
Second of all. Anyone with the idea that all People of color are on welfare or drugs is a fucking racist. Starting your argument with a statement like that removes much of your validity. Much like how if someone said "all gay people are sex crazed deviants because i saw some gay dudes shaking their asses on a float" is firstly a dumbass and secondly a Homophobe.
I have a serious question. Why is the older generation, the ones who fought tooth and nail to make it comfortable for MY generation to have the freedoms it has, try to live up to the societal norm? WHY do you respect the white patriarchy so much and WHY are you trying to live up to what everyone else thinks it means to be a "normal" man let alone person.
This idea that we have to "tone it down for those who are uncomfortable" (aka the bigots and homophobes) is far more damaging to the psyche of a young gay person than them being called names or being discriminated against. Because when you tell someone to "tone it down" you are inherently telling them that there is something indeed wrong with them, and that those bigots and homophobes are right. In essence you are victim blaming by saying something like that.
There are plenty of wholesome gay families who attend these parades and show out for their community...the issue is that Sensationalist media only gives you a few glimpses of the "audacious behavior" that you find so appalling, while leaving out all of the amazing, community building groups and families who attend.
[COLOR="blue"]I find it funny, as a person even, with very little to no gay rights or priviledges, that the ones most blessed and endowed with these things, fight for rights, but inhibit the expression to which the rights are fought for in the first place. Freedom.
I'll never understand, perhaps I'm not meant to, as to why self-depreciation and inhibitive tendencies are shown in regards to something that in actuality, proliferates growth.
Think about it, while it may be an eye sore to some, offensive to many and even gross to a few, it is literally the definition and reality of progress. How can you take a step, regardless of the direction, if you never move?
I don't view gay pride as sex, but if it is i interpreted that way, then it is evidently a lack of understanding of what messages there are and can be portrayed, and even less so the ability to take from and learn of what sex actually means, as opposed to the societal norm of what it should be.
Two men in speedos and whatever else, is first of all not sex, neither is it a representation of sex, this is a folly of the human mind and what it wants to see. It secondly does not represent any person who wears a speedo in any way comparitively speaking, because no two men in a speedo are the same.
Again, the mind wants to correlate the common link, to infer commonalities, which may or may not actually be so, simply because we like to group things.
Two men in speedos = Sex + they happen to be gay= all gay men wear speedos and act the same way.
However, like math, there are many variables to any given situation. Humans are hardwired however for the "easy way", in Arithmetics, Chess, Routes on a Road, even in regards to humans themselves, devising labels and idioms for certain groups and cultures, allowing for simpler and easier judgement.
People who view Pride parades as negative or sexually extreme, are well entitled to their opinion, but are essentially missing the whole picture or focussing too heavily on the pixels.
I'm not saying Pride is perfect, it has many flaws, but so do people in general. We can't expect it to please everyone, as not everyone is pleased the same way. However, everyone has the ability or should, to be able to not only for themselves make choices based on pros and cons of a situation both with and without personal bias, but also for others as well, as what you may not find enjoyable, someone else might.
I don't think it fair to take offense to someone else's joy. In this particular case, offense is not necessarily at the cost of other people's joy, but at the cost of one's own lack of common interest, despite popular belief.
Then again, I am fabulously and criminally insane [/COLOR]
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mile: Thanks.
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R: Don't come for me because i definitely wasn't coming for you.
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